The controversial SAND

Is it ok to use Sand?

  • Yes, it is ok

    Votes: 9 6.7%
  • No, NEVER use it

    Votes: 61 45.5%
  • It can be safe if done "right"

    Votes: 64 47.8%

  • Total voters
    134

Enigmatic_Reptiles

Quality is Everything
Messages
6,779
Location
Corona, CA
So we ALL know everyone says to NEVER keep a gecko on sand. The obvious reason everyone says is that impaction is almost inevitable. Do I keep mine on sand...No, mine are all on shelf liner and paper towels. My reason is not because everyone else told me not to, it is for simplicity of cleaning, cost effectiveness, and better humidity control. Do I believe sand can cause impaction...Yes I have seen it a couple times at our clinic. That being said I know of at least 1 "Big breeder" (300 + breeders) that houses on sand and he has told me they have not had a gecko die from impaction in 3 years. Can it be done safely? In my opinion YES it can. Would I suggest it? Only to experienced owners. I believe the biggest issue is not sand...its the type of sand being used. Grain size and manufactured/natural are two of the biggest culprits in impaction. I have done multiple necropsy on wc and domestic reptiles and every wc animals I worked on had grain in their gut. Similar to the gizzard of a bird, I believe that a natural flora of small particulate may actually increase the ability to break down and absorb nutrients from prey items. Thus the risk vs reward. So whats YOUR opinion on sand?
 

T2theG

New Member
Messages
36
Location
Florida
I think that sand can be used if it is done right. I don't particularly use sand, but I have my leo on Zoo Med's Excavator Clay substrate. I was a little skeptical at first, but after the product was set up and had time to dry it has worked out great. I had to add water to the clay substrate and then I was able to mold and shape the substrate in many ways. I was able to build a great and natural looking setup for my leo. The excavator clay dried rock hard and any loose particles can be picked up, plus spot cleaning is a breeze. Being able to build natural looking hides and multiples sight lines to reduce the amount of stress was a big factor for me. Anyone else had any experience with this excavator clay substrate?

 

GodzillaGecko

New Member
Messages
156
Location
Milford PA
I'm not all that well versed with desert species so I'm just gonna play it safe. It would also be easier to clean using slate tiles anyway.

I heard Excavator clay was hell to deal with and I heard some issues of lizards getting the clay stuck to them after going through the water and rubbing themselves on said clay. It looks nice though.
 

SC Geckos

New Member
Messages
854
Location
here
I used sand for my first two leos about 10 years ago and had no issues (They were sub adults when I switched to sand) They ate mealies out of a bowl but when I fed them crickets I just tossed them onto the sand for them to chase down. I am sure they ingested some sand at some point or another but never had an issue. I assume because they were healthy and properly hydrated so any small amout of sand was passed without issue. Now I use paper towels in my tubs because it so much easier to clean and its just one less thing I have to worry about.
 

Cesar_Da_KIng

Reptile Enthusiast
Messages
334
Location
Titusville, Florida
I see enigmatics point, my only problem is that you said you would only recommend experienced owners do it. Now you cant deny that there are some new owners out there that are gonna let that go completly over their heads and all they're gonna hear is "sand is just a big misunderstanding, so go ahead and use it!" and they wont hear the very important "Grain size and manufactured/natural are two of the biggest culprits in impaction."
With that being said i must say that im not a fan of people posting about sand be okay if done right cause alot of new owners will miss the "if done right" part and i just encourages bad care.
 

IrishOne81

Britt
Messages
2
Location
Tinton Falls, NJ, USA
I've used sand a few times for Leo. However, I will be switching over permanently to either pet carpets or just pape r towels. Not that its hard to clean but I'd rather my lil man not get impacted. I have seen Leo eat the sand before when chasing down crickets and when he does that he immediately gets a warm bath afterwards (usually within 8 hours of eating). He mostly eats mealworms (that I breed) and waxworms. I have not fed him pinkies before but as he is underweight that's my next step. Any other advice on fattening him is greatly appreciated! Thx :)
 

Jusselin

New Member
Messages
434
Would you encourage someone to use/start smoking cigarettes? Why would encourage any one to use anything with health risks and a possible fatality? Doesn't make since to me. Travis you have been so helpful ever since I joined this forum and I respect you alot! But as for this breeder friend... I know several friends of mine (including my dad) who have smoked for years and had no health problems what so ever (smoked for at least 60 years). That doesn't mean I would tell the next 18 year old to go for it.

The sand CAN cause impaction. If the breeder wants to go for it then we can't stop them. But for the DROVES of newbies signing up It should strongly be looked down upon and discouraged. For the geckos sake at least.
 

getgeckos

New Member
Messages
159
Location
Pittsburgh, Pa
I think that this is not a black and white issue. Sand can cause impaction, but it is likely because their husbandry wasn't spot on (temps too low, humidity off, etc). Saying that, I do believe that new reptile keepers should use tile or slate or paper towels while they learn the ropes and provide proper husbandry to their animals. All this "sand WILL kill your gecko" is just a bit of an overexaggeration in my opinion. It is the same type of mentality that has parents hovering over their children and never give them the opportunity to take a risk and try new things. This is why many younger people struggle with the harsh realities of life as they have never been tested in any way at an early age.

While sand does bring in an additional measure of caution when used, it can be done by keepers with experience. And for the record I currently don't use sand in any of my tanks/racks. I did my own experiment a couple of years ago and did a tank with multiple females with sand, one with a bioactive substrate, and then my racks with paper towels. No noticeable difference with the health or weight of my geckos was recorded. I believe that the bioactive substrate tank ended my data collection with the highest weights. I moved to an all rack system with the exception of one community tank as my collection has grown. I think we need to give accurate information to new reptile keepers and not be so "there is only one right way to do things". They need to understand the benefits and risks associated with the various substrates available.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
 

arianne

New Member
Messages
19
My leopard gecko died at the age of five from impaction. I was using play sand.

I suppose I did something wrong but I'm not sure what. Ever since then I have been using paper towels. All of my geckos are happy and spoiled.

Anyone have an idea what could of happened? All the temps. were right?
 

Jusselin

New Member
Messages
434
died at the age of five from impaction.

Anyone have an idea what could of happened?

1 + 1 = 2


Any way. The great sand debate seems pretty rediculous to me, and most people defending it won't/don't use sand. I started off with throwing my geckos on sand (I started off doing tons of things wrong, I was uneducated) and I was REEMED hard on this forum for it. After visiting a vet and being educated about the subject. I have the knowledge to make my own opinion. Tile is cleaner and easier to clean than sand. I would always recommend this. After seeing a Vet pull out a test tube full of "impaction" that he had collected from a gecko, it changed my mind for ever.
 

arianne

New Member
Messages
19
I meant to type "Anyone have an idea WHY she died from impaction if her temps. were right and such?"
 

getgeckos

New Member
Messages
159
Location
Pittsburgh, Pa
Because sand CAN still cause impaction. It could be related to a myriad of issues that contributed to the sand impaction. What are right temps for most geckos may need to be modified a bit for another because of various circumstances. It could have also been because of a lack of variety in his diet (all mealworms, etc) or many other reasons. This is why many keepers strongly recommend that sand not be used.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2
 

CNest

New Member
Messages
171
Location
St. Louis
I, personally, wont house on sand. I'm not comfortable with it. Would I like to be able to provide a more natural set up for a leo? Yes, most definitely. With that being said, if I did house on sand, I wouldn't be feeding on it. To me that makes no sense. They would be moved to a feeding tank or, if at all possible, have a feeding station that was somehow away from the sand (second level?). Obviously that would only work if the feeders couldn't get out of a feeding dish. With how they hunt for prey I just envision mouthful after mouthful of sand should the feeder be on the sand itself.
 

mudskipper

New Member
Messages
268
I won't use it because it gets everywhere and it's hard to clean. When one of my leopard geckos bites a dubia in half and its guts spews on the tile, I can wipe it off. Sand? I don't even want to think about it.
 

Enigmatic_Reptiles

Quality is Everything
Messages
6,779
Location
Corona, CA
Wow it is interesting to see how some people are comparing me saying it can be done safely to smoking. Are their risks associated with it..YES. But you mean to tell me you have never seen thermal burns from heating elements? Facilities burnt down from faulty wiring? Drowned geckos? Natural flora destroyed from cleaning chemicals? Loss of body parts due to poor humidity?Egg bound and died as result? The list can go on and on. This whole hobby/business is a RISK to our animals. We have our best intentions to keep them safe and provide what we ASSUME they want. Has anyone else here been to Afghanistan besides me? I vaguely remember there being a LOT of sand. Not as bad as Iraq...but I can assure you they are exposed to it (although they prefer rocky areas...but even the "rocky" areas are also compact sand).

Why don't we discuss sand. If someone wants to analyze what I post and somehow take my opinion and tweak it so I ever said that and treat it as gold and keep their gecko on sand...GRAT! Maybe they will contact me and can be properly educated on husbandry aspects affiliated with geckos and then have the information to make an educated decision (knowing I don't recommend it for beginners or novice). This is not about me or my opinion. Actually according to the poll, more people believe it can be done right. Instead of chastising those who choose to do it, why don't we help educate in SAFER use of the use of sand. Bottom line, if someone wants to do it...they will. Why not educate on what we know to be safer methods for the use of it?

Correct temps, supplements, etc. wont prevent compaction. Eating sand wont always cause compaction either. Breathing in air from a tub with sand in it probably would effect them less than breathing air from a tub with paper towel and the smell of warm plastic present. Sand is a topic where people are VERY passionate about their stance on the use of it and that is great. I just simply want to know WHY you have that stance. Is it from something you have heard? Read? Seen? Experienced? etc.
 

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