Husband's gecko is dying

Hi everyone,

I am on my husbands account. He has a leopard gecko and this gecko is about 3 years old. Boy about maybe 6-8 months ago, this gecko had stopped eating. She went a long while without losing weight and would very occasionally eat a worm here and there. Then she went completely anorexic, not eating at all. I am a scientist, so I have checked the lizard for parasites, and even gave the lizard a week dose of baytril in case there was a bacterial infection. But nothing, the lizard still wont eat. So we started forcefeeding emergency food that we got at the pet store. At first she would eat it, but now she is regurgitating it and even in that regurgitation, there looks to be streaks of red (blood?). Well now the lizard is starting to finally lose weight on her tail. Its getting really skinny. So we cant forcefeed her anymore, we tried antibiotics and we looked for parasites (and even treated with panacur).

I think the lizard is on its way out and I dont like watching her die what appears to be a slow, starvation like death. What do I do?

Vet is out of the question, I absolutely refuse to take a lizard to the vet (though my husband would of course). We had a VERY sick dog that we treated with a very EXPENSIVE surgery and now we also have a rescue dog. Im afraid our money needs to remain available for the dogs in case the one gets sick again. Sorry folks, but in this economy, we simply can not risk debt for a lizard!

Well any suggestions (aside from going to the vet) are welcome.

Anna

Sorry

Sorry ... PM PCPart or one of the sponsors of the Forum.:main_no:

Vet is out of the question, I absolutely refuse to take a lizard to the vet (though my husband would of course). We had a VERY sick dog that we treated with a very EXPENSIVE surgery and now we also have a rescue dog. Im afraid our money needs to remain available for the dogs in case the one gets sick again. Sorry folks, but in this economy, we simply can not risk debt for a lizard!

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Anna, I am so very sorry you are experiencing this tragic situation with your husband's gecko. What I am having a problem understanding is 'why' you think your dogs are more worthy of veterinary care than your gecko is. One of the responsibilities of keeping pets is to provide for their health, and yes... that takes money when they are sick.

I cannot understand why reptiles are considered 'disposable pets', and undeserving of the same care and treatment as any other beloved pet. Like you said, you would spend the money on your dog if it was exhibiting the same symptoms as your gecko... and this is a beautiful, gentle, living creature that is dire need of professional veterinary intervention!

I'm afraid you won't get much sympathy here on a forum that is based primarily on the love of geckos when you feel that providing the necessary care for yours is not worth the effort or money. If that is truly how you feel, then the most unselfish act of compassion you can do for your gecko is to end her agony and humanely euthanize her.

Vet is out of the question???:main_huh: I understand that times are tough But like Marcia Stated That is part of Being a responsible Pet owner. She is a Living, Breathing Animal Just like you and I and should be Giving the Chance at life just like anything else on Earth, I truely and Deeply feel for the Little Leo and can only wish that she is not suffering.:main_no:

What are the geckos' living conditions? Sometimes a change of scenery and some different food can stimulate their appetites. Try a new Repti Carpet, a new moist hide and some waxworms in a new bowl or something perhaps. Is there anything in the room that could be bothering the gecko? Bright lights, loud noises, heating vent?

But if the gecko is sick, it needs medical attention. I would make up some of the Golden Gate Geckos slurry and feed him that. In addition to being nutritious, it can help stimulate their appetite too.

What are you feeding her?
If she was eating 6 months ago, what have you changed in terms
of feeding or living conditions.
Have you checked the temps?
Can you post a pic of your setup?

Finally, if your husband would take her to the vet, but you wont, why
didn't he post? :main_huh:

So you came to a forum dedicated to geckos...
To devalue to the "worth" of a sick gecko in your care...

Wow.

My best advice is to find someone that will take that little one off your hands and get it the medical help it sounds like it desperately needs.




And I'll leave it at that before I get banned.

Thank you very much for your suggestions.

We did recently move about 8 months ago, could a move trigger anorexia such as this? Nothing in the cage is different...she uses a rock with a heat pad, has a wet hide (that we change the papertowels every 4-5 days), has a cold hide and we use paper towels.

Anyways i am reluctant to euthanize, and would probably put her outside (its winter here so he would probably die the most humanely.

If anyone can suggest what a vet can physically do to make a lizard better, please speak up. I am under the impression that antibiotics for a bacterial infection (tried that), fenbenazole for a parasitic infection. She has no blockage or else she would not poop the way she has.

Its not an issue of not taking to the vet because I "devalue" a lizards life, though I do think there is a hierarchy in our family as to who would receive medical attention. Its more of an issue of what can the vet do. For instance, this lizard could have a genetic deficiency from inbreeding. Do we do gene replacement therapy with a lizard. No you dont.

Let me know what a vet can do as I do process information and change opinions. But as of yet, no one has written a single thing that can convince me a vet can help.

Anna

Shes sick and you don't know why. Isn't that reason enough to get her medical attention?
Then atleast you would know what you were up against and could make your decision from there.

I can appreciate your concern about vet care when you've had a bad experience as you indicated. I also think that there can be a continuum of vet care (as well as human medical care) so that things don't automatically spiral out of control. I my opinion, the first thing to do is to find out what's wrong with the gecko. You indicate that you've tried some treatments for bacterial and parasitic infection and I'm assuming (correct me if I'm wrong) that you chose and provided the medication without consulting the vet. If this is the case (even with a vet input sometimes, in all fairness) the gecko may have one of these types of infections and the correct medication wasn't used. When I recommend taking it to the vet to find out what's wrong, I'm not saying necessarily that you take it in,the vet says "oh it's _____" and you have to do "_____" which costs "_____". That can be very frustrating because you may do what s/he says, pay the money and not get a good outcome.

I suggest that you plan for one vet visit to do the following:
a. see if the vet can determine what the problem is. This includes not only getting a diagnosis, but finding out from the vet why s/he thinks this is the diagnosis, what else it could possibly be and what the different treatments are depending on the diagnosis. Although we're not vets, a lay person should be able to determine from this information to what extent the vet is sure and to what extent they are grasping at straws. The most frustrating diagnosis is when the vet isn't sure and wants to do more testing, in which case, you have to find out how much this testing will cost and how definitive the results will be. There's a difference between "it may be this, and this particular lab test will tell us if we're right" and "we're not sure what it is, so we want to do this,this, this and this".

b. Get an idea of the chance of recovery and compare it to the expense of treatment. This is a very personal and difficult decision, especially when the chances aren't known. Deciding not to treat does not, in my opinion, necessarily mean that the owner doesn't care about the pet or considers it disposable.

c. If the vet feels there is no cure, or the decision is not to treat for other reasons, consult with the vet about humane euthanization. Many times a vet will have a method that works more effectively than the freezer or the snow.

I think that a lot of times we can try home remedies like changes in food or husbandry to cure a pet's problem, but when you tell me that the gecko is regurgitating, that seems to take it beyond the realm of home remedies.

I hope I have been successful in presenting some options without scolding or lecturing which I have tried to be careful not to do, and I am hoping for the best and most peaceful outcome for you, your husband and the gecko.

Aliza

I am not trying to be rude or mean in any way what-so-ever but i fail to understand why one pet would be considered worthy of medical attention and another isn't. My husband has a beagle and we take it to the vet when he needs to go- he loves that dog very much. I have geckos that I LOVE just as much. He would NEVER forbid me to get one of my babies medical attention because it wasn't a warm fuzzy. I have had several rescue geckos that I have spent a small fortune on. Yeah money is very tight for most of us right now so I do without that cup of cappacino that I like and I don't rent that movie so I can put extra money in the emergency fund. Theres a good chance that your husbands gecko can be saved with the right care. Every animal deserves a chance to live NOT just the warm blooded ones!!!!

Thank you Aliza for your comments. I do appreciate constructive input rather than the just "he's sick take him to the vet" response

As with all animals, there is a level of respect, love and many decisions go into deciding on the treatment. Although I love dogs with all my heart, I am aware that 4 floors above my work, dogs are used in testings for new heart transplants and the such. I am also aware that some people dont have a care in the world for dogs and don't even like them. Heck they will even run dog fighting rings.

Now personally, I don't want a lizard, and never did. but my husband loves them. So in that regard, I am working hard to respect this lizard and my husbands feelings. But I do not share the same "love" for lizards and the such. I cant stand that they eat mealworms and yes I feel bad for the mealworms and for grinding them up. I mean, if we take a lizard to the vet what is to stop taking a fish, or a mealworm to the vet. I guess I just have put limits on things and when we got the lizard, the limit was that our money would go to vet care for the dogs and not to the lizard. So I am doing as much as I humanly can with caring for this lizard but staying within the realm of our abilities. As with all things, there are many decisions that go into making the final decision and I am very appreciative of the people that offered constructive help in my predicament.

But I came to this forum asking for help and suggestions and a few responded with some help. Although I cant feed the lizard the slurry with ground up mealworms (just as I can not kill the bees that are in my attic or kill the lizard) I will try moving him to a new location without so much noise. maybe that will help.

Anna

Rubym,

I guess the crux of the problem is that I do not see a lizard as a "pet". I also do not see fish or a frog as a "pet". Maybe that is where our differences lie. The lizard shuns human contact. A lizard would not "choose" to live in a tank. Lizards are very different from dogs who enjoy and cherish human contact.

I would also not keep a pig as a pet, or a cow as a pet or a squirrel as a pet or a skunk, or really anything but a dog and maybe a cat. People have differences of opinion and this is just mine. I am here really for my husband as I am reaching the end of my rope with this reptile.

Anna

Is your husband capable of making the slurry? It really might make a difference.

I respect that we all have difeerent opinions of what makes a good pet. I see the different personalities that each of my reptiles have. I have several that seem to enjoy human contact. Reptiles are not for everyone....just as a pet pig or a pet cow would not be as you pointed out. Funny thing is my sister in law lived on a farm and she actually had both, LOL. OI often wondered what she saw in them and even asked once and she said that she just loved them. You asked what a vet could do for a reptile. My sick little rescue when we got her she was regurgitating any food that she ate. She was put on several different medications. She had gastroenteritis and a horrible case of pin worms. I did have to get over having a weak stomach and grind up the worms ( as someone said maybe your husband could do that part). I bought and old blender from the good will. I was in no way trying to be mean to you. I guess you could say that I am just an advocate for equal treatment of any animal that we decide to take responcibility for. I guess I am just one of those "bleeding heart" type people. I got it from my father and theres not much that I can do to change it. I wish your husband the best of luck with his little one.

Thank you ruby,

unfortunately, the lizard does not have pinworms. I actually have a doctorate in science and run my own fecal tests. Im pretty trained in microbiology-and definitely no pinworms. Your lizards gastroenteritis came from the pinworms. My lizard actually has standard poops...no diarrhea as is seen with parasitic infections.

I guess what I want to know is this: What else can the vet do? besides put on antibiotics (since I tried with baytril which is as powerful as you can get with a lizard) or deworm? Has anyone been to a vet and walked away with a diagnosis that was not a bacterial infection or parasitic? (or blockage for that matter, as we are 99% sure no blockage)

Also, I would have to ground up the mealworms. I do not have a weak stomach as evidence by my line of work. I just will not ground up mealworms. They are alive as well and do not need to be put in a grinder. I have an emergency liquid from the pet store.

I understand the "bleeding heart" trait. But as I am older and thinking now about becoming a mother, having a house, needing a new roof, taking care of my husband and 2 dogs, I have set priorities and boundaries and have to live by them- as we all do!

Anna

Cheaton said:

If anyone can suggest what a vet can physically do to make a lizard better, please speak up... Its not an issue of not taking to the vet because I "devalue" a lizards life, though I do think there is a hierarchy in our family as to who would receive medical attention. Its more of an issue of what can the vet do.

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We cannot diagnose from a distance and tell you how to treat your gecko, nor can we tell you "what a vet can physically do to make a lizard better" without knowing what is wrong. If you want to "fix" the gecko, you need to have it looked at by someone who knows what they are doing. A good exotics vet should be able to diagnose your gecko and tell you what is wrong with it. Depending on what the vet finds out after examining the animal, it may be a curable condition or it may not. Waiting until the animal was in this condition before seeking help definately does not help its chances of survival, but a good vet might be able to save it regardless, and at an economical rate. Have a budget when you approach the vet and tell him you cannot spend more than X. Most vets are very understanding of this and will work with you to do as much as they can as cheaply as possible.

Your gecko is obviously very sick and needs medical attention that you are not capable of providing with your current knowledge level. Unless you are incredibly lucky, randomly throwing antibiotic and antiparasite medications at an animal won't correct anything; you need to know what is wrong with the gecko before being able to treat it effectively. THAT is why everyone has been suggesting that you take the gecko to the vet.

I do not understand how you can have ethical problems with humanely killing mealworms, yet are willing to watch an animal suffer through an illness long term without proper medical attention, and have considered throwing that same animal outside in a world totally foreign to it and letting it freeze/starve to death. I have a feeling that if someone did that to their dog you would be furious.

Cheaton said:

If anyone can suggest what a vet can physically do to make a lizard better, please speak up... Its not an issue of not taking to the vet because I "devalue" a lizards life, though I do think there is a hierarchy in our family as to who would receive medical attention. Its more of an issue of what can the vet do.

Click to expand...

We cannot diagnose from a distance and tell you how to treat your gecko, nor can we tell you "what a vet can physically do to make a lizard better" without knowing what is wrong. If you want to "fix" the gecko, you need to have it looked at by someone who knows what they are doing. A good exotics vet should be able to diagnose your gecko and tell you what is wrong with it. Depending on what the vet finds out after examining the animal, it may be a curable condition or it may not. Waiting until the animal was in this condition before seeking help definately does not help its chances of survival, but a good vet might be able to save it regardless, and at an economical rate. Have a budget when you approach the vet and tell him you cannot spend more than X. Most vets are very understanding of this and will work with you to do as much as they can as cheaply as possible.

Your gecko is obviously very sick and needs medical attention that you are not capable of providing with your current knowledge level. Unless you are incredibly lucky, randomly throwing antibiotic and antiparasite medications at an animal won't correct anything; you need to know what is wrong with the gecko before being able to treat it effectively. THAT is why everyone has been suggesting that you take the gecko to the vet.

I do not understand how you can have ethical problems with humanely killing mealworms, yet are willing to watch an animal suffer through an illness long term without proper medical attention, and have considered throwing that same animal outside in a world totally foreign to it and letting it freeze/starve to death. I have a feeling that if someone did that to their dog you would be furious.

Alicia,

My concern is that there are no other treatment options for the lizard that a vet would offer. Please someone give me an example of how you walked away from the vet and they diagnosed the lizard with something other than bacterial or parasitic infection. I mean, like liver problems? kidney problems? heart problems. What treatment is there for anything that is not bacterial or parasitic.

See the answer that I am thinking is that there is no other treatment options available for the lizard (because it is afterall a lizard).

Please do not judge me, I am not judging you... I am asking for information and if all you can offer is a judgement, please do not hit the post reply button.

Anna

Anna,

I am very sorry if I came across as being judgemental. I do have a bad habit of being overly straightforward to the point I sound snide when I don't mean to. We have a special bond with our animals and its sounds almost like a foreign language to us when someone has a different view.
We have taken reptiles to our vet in the past that have been in kidney and liver failure as well as had enlarged hearts and other problems that were not parasitic or bacterial. There are medications that can treat these conditions if they are caught in time.
I can't remember off-hand the names of all the medications, but I know our one burmese python rescue, Hera, was prescribed Allipurinol to help with the kidney failure issue. She was given other meds at the vets office, but this was what was sent home with us.
Antibiotics have to be given in precise amounts and with an abundance of fluids or they cause kidney failure.
A lack of eating can cause the liver to become fragile in reptiles. When the animal starts eating again, smaller meals need to be given to allow the liver to build back up again. A large meal, believe it or not, can kill a reptile quickly when its battling liver function issues.

I hope this helped to answer some of your concerns. If I'm still off the mark, please let me know.

K