Bait stores?

[Yoh4n]

Hey I was wondering if bait stores sell mealworms and if they do is there a difference between them and and the pet stores, are the pet store meal worms more clean or something? Im asking because I live in MN and i see a lot of bait store close by closer then pet stores.

 

[UnicornSpirit]

I think Timberline Fisheries sells their products to bait stores somtimes (as well as pet stores) http://www.timberlinefisheries.com/

To be safe, I would stick to the pet store feeders because you never know if bait stores are getting their products from reliable sources (because, really, who cares if that bug you're using as bait has parasites when you're just using it to lure fish- not to nourish a pet).

Talking about price, even if you just have a couple leopard geckos I would just go ahead and buy 500 or 1,000 bulk from Timberline. As long as you feed the worms twice a week and change their bedding as needed they will last for MONTHS in the fridge. I've bought from them before and although there are cheaper places (Grubco), I felt as if their insects were plumper, healthier and packaged better.

Think of how much pet stores rip you off... it's probably cheaper to just buy directly from the supplier! :]

Good luck!

 

[Dog Shrink]

Bait stores either grow their own or buy from the same bulk manufacturers that supply pet stores honestly. I have gone both ways and have had no difficulties.

 

[Yoh4n]

OK thanks! I only have 1 gecko btw im thinking about getting 1 more

 

[tastyworms]

I too would worry that bait stores might have lower standards than a pet store. In their mind most of them are going into the water, and they happen to have a problem with their product, they're not going to take it as seriously.

 

[Dog Shrink]

I too would worry that bait stores might have lower standards than a pet store. In their mind most of them are going into the water, and they happen to have a problem with their product, they're not going to take it as seriously.

I think your opinion is a bit bias tho hon... after all you SELL worms. It doesn't matter WHAT standards a bait shop or a pet shop have it is the standard set by the people that regulate the feed industry is all that matters and they ALL have to follow it.

 

[tastyworms]

I think your opinion is a bit bias tho hon... after all you SELL worms. It doesn't matter WHAT standards a bait shop or a pet shop have it is the standard set by the people that regulate the feed industry is all that matters and they ALL have to follow it.

Dog Shrink - I have the utmost respect for you and I hope you do not take any offense to my comments as none is intended. I am not an expert in geckos, but if you're looking for a software engineer or someone who is familiar with pet food regulation - you've come to the right place!

Unfortunately, the pet food industry is not actually regulated in the way you described. The FDA has only a limited part in regulating pet foods. Essentially, the only requirements they have are that packaged foods are labeled truthfully, and that they contain a guaranteed analysis. There is zero verification of these analysis, and pet food sales do not require pre-approval provided they contain ingredients which are known to be safe (99.9% of the industry).

I know this because I had to signed up with the various local and federal regulators when I started my corporation. I also signed up with APHIS which regulates the interstate trafficking of insects.

Live insects are regulated by the USDA for the sole purpose of keeping invasive species out. APHIS requires that you have plans on file for containment, and destruction of the insects if necessary. Mealworms do not actually fall under this regulation at all.

Live insects basically fall through the proverbial cracks of feed regulation because they aren't necessarily feed. Mealworms for instance are sold for scientific, education, fishing, feed, and pet purposes (in toys such as beetle barn).

http://www.fda.gov/animalveterinary/products/animalfoodfeeds/petfood/ucm2006475

Giant mealworms are a perfect example of the non-regulation of the industry. They are normal mealworms sprayed with an insecticide which is a synthesized insect juvenile growth hormone. These are commonly sold in bait stores. Imagine someone walking in there and buying a cup for their pet insect or invertebrate? Will the bait shop owner warn the customer?

I'm not trying to sell something to the original poster. I just implore everyone to buy from a pet store, because that is the only type of store which has the final destination of your purchase in mind.

Are bait stores inherently bad to purchase from? Not at all. My only point is that they are not intending their product to end up where you are putting it.

I'm hesitant to say "trust me on this" because as Dog Shrink points out - I do have an obvious conflict of interest. I could tell you stories about nameless bulk manufacturers, as I've spent thousands of dollars through them in the past. Stories about mites, dermestid beetles, grain moths, and other unwanted guests. A local competitor by the name of Lucky Lure Crickets recently went under because of some worms they purchased from a bulk manufacturer that infected them with the cricket virus. Truth be told, none of these things probably matter to you because they're not going to hurt your gecko. But, they bother me.

I apologize for the long winded reply, but this is something I know well.

 

[Dog Shrink]

Long winded reply is perfect. So what is stopping the pet food providing worm growers from also spraying their worms with that growth hormone then? Also I'm sure it is kinda of unlikely that the people who mass farm mealies are not sending different lower quality mealies to the bait shops versus the pet stores. I'm pretty sure they grow them all the same with the same consideration for their final destination. They don't say Oh this batch is just going to a bait shop, we can skimp on the gutloading or feed or substrait th're in versus this group which is pet shop bound so they get the A+ quality bedding and gutload etc. If I'm off base please enlighten me.

 

[fl_orchidslave]

Even for one gecko, it's worth it to order 500 mealworms from a breeder as opposed to local purchase at the pet or bait shop. Why deal with half dead or questionable feeders? Top quality, fresh stock from the breeder. They can be stored in the fridge for several months with minimal care, and would likely be consumed in that time. Even looking at cost, 2-3 bucks a week for a small cup + tax + gas - dead worms x 4 months. Something to think about

 

[fl_orchidslave]

As far as spraying with growth hormones, a lot of pet feeder farmers started breeding feeders for their own animals and it turned into a good side business for them. They talk about how their feeders are raised on their homepages. There are others that are strictly commercial, those don't fare well in the pet trade. It's not their target market either. It is our responsibility as the consumer to properly feed and gutload insects in our care, since a lot of insects don't hold additional nutrients within their systems for a long period of time. I've never used giant mealworms, just regular ones and they aren't that big at all. Superworms don't need any hormones to get 2" long Imagine a giant cricket...... bait shops would sell a lot of those!

 

[tastyworms]

Long winded reply is perfect. So what is stopping the pet food providing worm growers from also spraying their worms with that growth hormone then? Also I'm sure it is kinda of unlikely that the people who mass farm mealies are not sending different lower quality mealies to the bait shops versus the pet stores. I'm pretty sure they grow them all the same with the same consideration for their final destination. They don't say Oh this batch is just going to a bait shop, we can skimp on the gutloading or feed or substrait th're in versus this group which is pet shop bound so they get the A+ quality bedding and gutload etc. If I'm off base please enlighten me.

As you point out, the worms come from the same place. The pet food stores, including mine, stock giants, which are in fact sprayed with the hormone. The difference is that if a consumer were to have a question about the product, the bait shop owner may not be able to answer it.

The "big guys" don't gut load or use A+ quality bedding. They use the cheapest methods available to them. Wholesale on mealworms is under $3/1k - they couldn't afford too.

The pet store owner understands the final destination of the product. If for instance, I got a shipment that had mites in it. I would destroy it. I'm not sure a bait shop would care. Once again, I can't speak for them, but if it's going into a lake or the ocean - why worry about it? It's not going to hurt the fish.

You're not necessarily going to get a bad product at a bait store. I just argue that it's more likely. Also, keep in mind I live in Florida. We've got an average of 85% humidity (perfect for breeding all sorts of parasites) and a lot of our bait shops are a guy on the side of the road with a sign that says "bait."