Thinking about pairing these two... Think they're an ok match?

[LIZARDLOVER]

I have a 7 year old male Murphy's (58g) that I'm thinking about pairing with a 3 year old 43.5g Tremper female I got from a friend. Do you think she'll be able to handle him?

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[tb144050]

Most breeders recommend waiting until the female is around 55g or more before being introduced to males because they can become egg-bound due to their small size.

Once she is 55g, I would probably put them together and carefully monitor them for a few minutes to be sure it isn't violent. :O

Also, do you know the "full" genetics of them? Unless you have "hidden hets", you will end up with "normals het murphy het tremper".

What will you be doing with the babies?

 

[LIZARDLOVER]

I'd be raising them and selling them to some friends of mine, as well as craigslist. I'd keep a few for fun. I heard that most breeders say 45, not 55.


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[tb144050]

I'd be raising them and selling them to some friends of mine, as well as craigslist. I'd keep a few for fun. I heard that most breeders say 45, not 55.


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I waited/am-waiting for 55g for my females because most people on this forum say 50minimum/55safer. But I really replied to let you know, if you aren't having any luck selling the first pairs of geckos, you can always choose to stop incubating later clutches/eggs... I don't know how alot of people feel morally about this, but I feel that it would be better than having homeless-geckos or overcrowded geckos.

 

[LIZARDLOVER]

Will all due respect I've probably kept reptiles longer than you, this is my 8th year I just haven't bred anything other than P. picta. I wouldn't just leave the eggs to die, they're still life forms even if they're encapsulated in a shell.


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[tb144050]

Will all due respect I've probably kept reptiles longer than you, this is my 8th year

No disrespect taken. I always try to state that I am an amateur and state my sources (whether website links or just "common practice" of majority of people that have more experience than me). As I am learning, I just try to "pay it forward" by sharing what I have read/learned along the way.

I will refrain from giving any more advice to you about leopard geckos, even if the advice is from leopard gecko breeders on this page. I apologize for doubting your 8 years of experience.

I wouldn't just leave the eggs to die, they're still life forms even if they're encapsulated in a shell.

I am glad that you have a firm standing on the "abortion debate". I have stated in other posts that I would consider "not incubating" eggs if I suspect they will probably have birth defects. I may change my mind if I actually have to make that hard decision one day. But I respect your opinion and your decisions in your own home.

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If I ever accidently reply to your posts again, please let me know that you don't want replies from someone with less than 8 years of experience in other reptiles.

 

[LIZARDLOVER]

No need to be sarcastic; I was merely put off by the lack of respect on the other thread you replied to. A forum is a place to build one another up and to be friendly, not to put people down even if it's done "respectfully". There's always a better way to advise people than to merely say they're wrong for this this and that. Remember that; people will be much more open to your advice if it isn't given in a rude manner. And if it comes down to it, sometimes the best thing you can do is hold your tongue. There are people here who have been working with reptiles for decades, if you can't find a nice way to give advice then just don't post and let one of them take up the slack.

 

[tb144050]

I will apologize for my sarcasm in the last paragraph. I was "put off" by your last comment above mine....didn't realize that your last comment was fueled by my last post on someone else's topic.

But in that other topic, I went into detail to convince the OP (over there) that "he isn't ready(!!)". I tried to express my genuine good intent and good nature, but I am a product of 2 factors:

1) I was raised to "say what I mean and mean what I say" (speak very clearly)
+
2) I am very detailed in my writing and language skills when I "say what I mean".

The end product is that "when I say, in detail, what I mean...well it just sounds mean." For that, I simply have to add lines that say "I say this politely and with good intent" and I add smiley faces to help the OP understand that I am not angry or intending to be rude.

It is very difficult to express a feeling of "good intent" to a person who can only read the text on their screen. I wish I could press a button on my keyboard and make people understand that I am wanting to help them, not hurt feelings. But "text on a screen" is like beauty: It "is in the eye of the beholder"..... The text, like beauty, will be interpreted by the reader based on the reader's mood, past experiences, etc, etc...

 

[tb144050]

Will all due respect I've probably kept reptiles longer than you, this is my 8th year

btw, I am still not sure if this was in response to my contribution that "most people on this forum say 50minimum/55safer" or in response to the "aborting incubation" topic.

I think was in response to the recommended weight, but I have no personal experience on that subject.

About the "aborting incubation of later clutches," I would like to know if an egg contains an undeveloped yolk or if it has achieved a consciousness. This is the determining-factor for several abortion-beliefs in human embryos. If I find out that a freshly laid gecko egg has achieved consciousness, I will be the first person to change positions and say "it is NEVER ok."

Until I know this, I really can't make a decision on "not incubating" a clutch. I hope I never have to make that decision anyway.

(again, some of my sentences may sound rude, but please read them as "intelligent conversation". I mean no rude attitude, harshness, or sarcasm in this post. ....just conversation for the purpose of learning.)

 

[geckos9]

@OP- I would wait until she is 50 grams. From my research and own personal experience, I find this to be a good weight for females to be at. For most breeders, 50 grams is the minimum while 60 grams is the maximum.

Also: I would not recommend selling them as "breeders" since you do not know of the parents' hets.

Good luck to you and your geckos and if you decide to breed them, please post photos of the hatchlings - I'd love to see them!

 

[stager]

That female is way to thin to breed wait till her tail is nice and fat

 

[LIZARDLOVER]

I don't know that I'd call her tail thin, proportionally she's quite healthy she's just a tad small. Not quite dwarf sized but small.

 

[DrCarrotTail]

I would wait for her to be at least 50g or over a year old before breeding. 45g is the bare minimum when most geckos become sexually mature. I have several females that are around 45g full grown but waited until they were starting their second season to breed them to make sure they just didn't start to ovulate before they were ready and able to handle the stress of egg laying. While it is possible to breed at that size I would recommend letting her grow a bit just to play it safe. In my experience younger females that are just big enough to breed crash harder during the breeding season. If it is your first time learning the ropes of breeding leos I would allow for a bit of extra weight just to play it safe. Better safe then sorry when it comes to the health of your female and the health of her babies.

 

[LIZARDLOVER]

She's 3.5 years old, a first time breeder but for sure not immature hence the reason I was unsure.

 

[DrCarrotTail]

If she's 3.5 and only 50g that's probably the biggest she's gonna get. I don't see a reason to put more weight on her before breeding. The only reason I might hesitate is if you aren't sure of her genetic background. If you're not you'll produce babies that will probably need to find pet homes and they can be kinda tough to find. If you are willing to keep them or know folks who want them it won't be an issue

 

[LIZARDLOVER]

That's what I was thinking, that she's about full grown. I have homes available and don't mind the extras if I have to hold back (more the merrier!!) I'm 99% positive she's a Tremper, given that I bought her at a pet co when bells were uncommon and rainwaters were quite pricey. Process of elimination suggests that for her to be wholesaled at 15 to sell for 25 she has to be a Tremper. Likewise with the patty, there's no way he's a bell and so 50/50 rainwater or Tremper; if the babies are albino he must be a tremper. Seems like sound logic to me, but of course I would disclose that information to buyers prior to selling and would warn of any unknown hets.