TUG Snow vs. Mack Snow

[Yosemite Sam]

I was looking at both the leopardgeckowiki and TUG's site and others that have Mack Snows available. I was wondering what the main difference between the two morphs are, and if anyone has had any good experience with TUG Snows and their breeding?

 

[paulnj]

My friend says his TUG's won't grow for him, but I have no experience with them.

 

[Nigel4less]

TUG Snows are supposedly a Dominant Morph, and have produced Supers when bred to Macks. I don't work with them either.

 

[ataber]

i like the price of mack snows better but dont know anything really about TUG snows, might try the search function in the forums im not positive but i think there have been discussions about TUG snows b4

 

[DAWNoftheLEO]

Never worked with em..

 

[Gazz]

TUG Snows are supposedly a Dominant Morph, and have produced Supers when bred to Macks. I don't work with them either.

If you can breed a.
Mack snow(co-dom) X Mack snow(co-dom).
Mack snow(co-dom) X TUG snow(dominant).
Mack snow(co-dom) X Snow(line breed).
And all these result in super snow offspring should super snow be just super snow all the time.Is there any need mention mack when it comes to super snows ??.Would it really be a mack super snow if the parentage was mack X TUG ??.

 

[Nigel4less]

How do you produce a SS from Mack X LB Snow that doesn't make any since. If one is Line Bred and one is Co-Dom, LB Snows are really just normals selectively bred for the White coloration. So maybe if you have some proof to shed some light on the subject.

 

[paulnj]

Well not to down anyone, but I think the genetics behind them are questionable myself ..... as with a few other person's lines. They look very nice by all means, but genetics plays a big part in my choices.

Anyone wants my reasoning... It won't be posted here:main_lipsrsealed:

 

[Gazz]

So maybe if you have some proof to shed some light on the subject.

No proof just what i've read about the forum some time ago.Basically said mack bred to any snow line will result in super snow.I've not directally seen the super snow of a MACK X TUG yet would love to see one.Maybe it's down to the whiteness in the DNA info getting confused and there for clickinng with mack and resulting in super snows offspring.

Why do you find it hard that a mack X line breed can give suer snow when you can breed a mack(co-dom) X TUG(dominant) and get super snow.TUG act in a dominant way but are basically line breed also they was collect from wild stock and then bred to a standed of desirer.And if mack clicks TUG's why can't it click with other's.

Info on TUG snows from TUG site.

If there’s an absolute ideal for this type of morph, we think this is it. We acquired this incredible gene pool as a wild-caught group several years ago and we have been selectively breeding them ever since. There is much debate surrounding this unique and wonderful morph. From our breeding results, we believe our bloodline is a type of axanthic, a genetic trait where the subject has little or no yellow pigment. In most cases this trait has been proven to be recessive but in our group, we believe it to be dominant. Our exclusive Snows are unrelated to any known in captivity, boasting incredible white coloration and reduced black spotting. This is truly a rare opportunity to acquire this remarkable lineage.

 

[malt_geckos]

eh...not a fan of TUG

 

[GeckoRing]

I love the TUG snows! They produce outstanding snows. I'm not sure that you can say they are basically line bred. I am working with them this year in a different way than we have in the past. I'm hoping to understand them a little better and be able to give more information. We will be breeding with SHTCT, Bell SS, and Enigmas. I like there look a lot more than the macks.

 

[liljenn]

I am new at all this genetic stuff but from my understanding, I know that Mack is a co-dominant and the other "line-bred" Snows (TUG, Gem, Albey, etc) are incomplete dominant. If the TUG was dominant, how come it deviates to produce SS when crossed with a Mack, just like all the other lines?

I am looking to work more with the Gem Snow line. From what I've read, it is an incomplete dominant morph giving you more of a "blended" result from what it is crossed with and with Gem X Gem, it gets more white - just like the TUG line. Just my opinion.

Michelle - I look forward to seeing what you come up with!! Sound interesting!

 

[Kotsay1414]

As far as my understanding, there are four different types of Snows, Mack Snows, Gem Snows, Line-Bred Snows, and TUG Snows. Mack Snows are incomplete dominate. This comes from the heterozygous form of them. The Mack Snows can have varying shades of yellow and some have had random Snake Eyes. This is a blend between a wild type (Normal) and a Super Snow (homozygous form).

Gem Snows and TUG Snows are very similar in my opinion. TUG Snows are dominate and thus far Gem Snows have proven to be dominate. With both, Gem Snows and TUG Snows, they seem to hold their white better than Mack Snows.

Line-Bred Snows are what their name suggest, line-bred for their whiteness.

When breeding any of the three types (Gem, TUG, or Line Bred) to a Mack Snow or Super Snow, Super Snows can be and have been produced.

On top of all of this, Albey did a great cross with his Mack Snows and his Line Bred Snow/Facsiolatius Leopard Geckos... I'll pull up the thread.

 

[Kotsay1414]

http://geckoforums.net/showthread.php?t=3825 is the link to Albey's cross thread.

 

[liljenn]

http://geckoforums.net/showthread.php?t=3825 is the link to Albey's cross thread.

That is too funny!! I JUST got done reading that thread after doing a search!! GREAT POST!! Very educational!

 

[Nigel4less]

No proof just what i've read about the forum some time ago.Basically said mack bred to any snow line will result in super snow.I've not directally seen the super snow of a MACK X TUG yet would love to see one.Maybe it's down to the whiteness in the DNA info getting confused and there for clickinng with mack and resulting in super snows offspring.

Why do you find it hard that a mack X line breed can give suer snow when you can breed a mack(co-dom) X TUG(dominant) and get super snow.TUG act in a dominant way but are basically line breed also they was collect from wild stock and then bred to a standed of desirer.And if mack clicks TUG's why can't it click with other's.

Info on TUG snows from TUG site.

Because technically they are Normals selectively bred for white. So Mack Snow X Line-Bred(Normal/Snow). That basically saying you are breeding a Tangerine to a Mack Snow you`ll get a Super Snow. Because in all reality, Tangerines and Snows are pretty much the same thing(Normals) selectively bred for their specific coloration whether it be reduction in spots,brighter yellow/orange hues, or bred for pale white coloration. The reason TUGs and Macks click is because TUGS like you stated already are (Dominant) and Mack s are(Co-Dom/Incomplete Dom). Since LB Snows are Line-Bred Normals they can only produce 50% Macks and 50% Normals/LB Snows.

 

[Kotsay1414]

Check out the thread from Albey, it is pretty interesting...

Because technically they are Normals selectively bred for white. So Mack Snow X Line-Bred(Normal/Snow). That basically saying you are breeding a Tangerine to a Mack Snow you`ll get a Super Snow. Because in all reality, Tangerines and Snows are pretty much the same thing(Normals) selectively bred for their specific coloration whether it be reduction in spots,brighter yellow/orange hues, or bred for pale white coloration. The reason TUGs and Macks click is because TUGS like you stated already are (Dominant) and Mack s are(Co-Dom/Incomplete Dom). Since LB Snows are Line-Bred Normals they can only produce 50% Macks and 50% Normals/LB Snows.

 

[boutiquegecko]

Could the macks, gem and tug be the same snow, only different degrees of whiteness? I'm wondering this because of the outcomes when crossed with each other or with a mack. You get ss's, but they are still ss, so isn't it possible they are the same gene? Without a dna test how are we telling them apart really? Is it a mack gem ss? Or gem tug ss? Or just ss?
Did they all come from the same wild caught group?
Have the gems and tugs not been worked with enough to prove if these are all the same gene, and not dominant but incomplete like the mack?

 

[Gazz]

Because technically they are Normals selectively bred for white. So Mack Snow X Line-Bred(Normal/Snow). That basically saying you are breeding a Tangerine to a Mack Snow you`ll get a Super Snow. Because in all reality, Tangerines and Snows are pretty much the same thing(Normals) selectively bred for their specific coloration whether it be reduction in spots,brighter yellow/orange hues, or bred for pale white coloration. The reason TUGs and Macks click is because TUGS like you stated already are (Dominant) and Mack s are(Co-Dom/Incomplete Dom). Since LB Snows are Line-Bred Normals they can only produce 50% Macks and 50% Normals/LB Snows.

No it's not :main_rolleyes: tangerine is enhanced yellow to the point of tangerine.The mack gene deffantally won't get confused with that as the DNA info will say tangerine.Line snow are decreased yellow to the point of white this is where i am saying that the mack gene maybe getting confused.As the DNA info is saying white resulting in super snow offspring.Both line snow and tangerine though both line bred traits both act in a dominant manner for at least around 4-to-5 generations of out breeding due to the influance being wedged ferm in the there roots.TUG snow's are from wild stock not just one but several indivduals they was selectively bred to the standed they are today.At bare roots also line breed that act in a dominant manner remember TUG say's they belive them to be dominant not that they 100% are.Ask your self why would you need to selectively breed a dominant morph ??.Point is you wouldn't you breed them,Then get more of them no matter what you breed to.TUG snow's like the other strains of line bred snow are basically line bred but TUG snows are just a little more direct from the wild than the long line of line breed 100% captive strain line bred snows.

 

[paulnj]

I can punch holes in the genetic discription of TUG snows on the site without thinking..:main_evilgrin: :main_lipsrsealed: