age or size for breeding

[rubym]

I have a female that is 34 grams and she is 8 months old. I was wondering at what age or size is it safe to breed her? I have 2 males. One is 38 grams and 10 months old and my older male is 3 and 44 grams. I don't want to put her with either until I am sure it is safe for her. I have a crested book and it doesn't tell anywhere in it. Thanks

 

[THE WHISPERER]

at least 50 grams

 

[thestack510]

Cresteds, right? It's 50g for Leos but I don't know about cresteds.

 

[Valley Reptiles]

at least 50 grams

I believe that's for leos.

The Rhac book says 30 to 35 grams, my smallest was 28 grams when she laid her first eggs. I introduce females around 25 to 30 grams.

 

[tap1974]

She is big enough now. 30 grams is the normal rule. I have heard of people breeding them at as small as 25 grams.

 

[THE WHISPERER]

at least 50 grams

ooops my bad I didn't pick up on that at first, sorry :uhoh2:

 

[rubym]

Thanks. I just wanted to make sure. I didn't want to do anything to jeopardize her health. She is a beautiful little harely girl and I waited FOREVER to get a girl so I'd feel aweful if I bred her too soon. The book I have wasn't very specific on any of the breeding points. Thanks again for the info.

 

[Haroldo]

She is big enough now. 30 grams is the normal rule. I have heard of people breeding them at as small as 25 grams.

30 grams is the normal rule according to who? I'm starting my 5th season now and I've heard nothing but 35 grams or better. Hearing people breed doesn't mean is with the animal's best interest in mind. We also breed Perro de Presa Canario (a large, molosser-type dog) and hear about females being bred at 1yr...doesn't make it responsible.

Thanks. I just wanted to make sure. I didn't want to do anything to jeopardize her health. She is a beautiful little harely girl and I waited FOREVER to get a girl so I'd feel aweful if I bred her too soon. The book I have wasn't very specific on any of the breeding points. Thanks again for the info.

I think you'd be making a mistake breeding her this soon! 25 grams is not only small for a mature female, but she's likely not even sexually mature. She's only 8 months, and the MINIMUM I'd ever recommend a female being bred is 12 months (I wait until 18 months). What's the rush? With a species that lives 15-20 years, there's alot of reproductive potential ahead of her. Even if she does give you fertile eggs (And that's a BIG if), you'd likely get small hatchlings lacking vigor, and you're risking her health. Why not give it another 6 months, and have a healthy (good-sized) female breed in the early part of summer?

If you haven't gotten it, pick up the Rhacodactylus book by Repashy, Fast, and DeVosjoli. It's not the only way to keeping Rhacodactylus, but i believe the ideals laid out in this book are generally accepted husbandry principles that have yielded the most success in the last decade or so.

 

[Valley Reptiles]

30 grams is the normal rule according to who? I'm starting my 5th season now and I've heard nothing but 35 grams or better. Hearing people breed doesn't mean is with the animal's best interest in mind. We also breed Perro de Presa Canario (a large, molosser-type dog) and hear about females being bred at 1yr...doesn't make it responsible.

It's in the "rhac book" 30 to 35 grams, that's where most people get it from.

Breeding a female smaller isnt risking her health, Alan himself even posted on his forums that he lets future breeding groups grow up together (male & females) and the geckos decide when they are ready to breed. If it was bad for the geckos I'm sure he wouldnt be doing it. I've been doing the same for 8 years and the hatchings are perfectly healthy, no females have had any problems and and their hatchlings are not any smaller than some of the 40 gram females babies I hatched. The females usually grow another 5 to 10 grams before the eggs are layed anyway.
Waiting to breed at 35 grams is fine but breeding at lower weights doesnt mean it is wrong or is jeopardizing the geckos health.

 

[Haroldo]

It's in the "rhac book" 30 to 35 grams, that's where most people get it from.

Breeding a female smaller isnt risking her health, Alan himself even posted on his forums that he lets future breeding groups grow up together (male & females) and the geckos decide when they are ready to breed. If it was bad for the geckos I'm sure he wouldnt be doing it. I've been doing the same for 8 years and the hatchings are perfectly healthy, no females have had any problems and and their hatchlings are not any smaller than some of the 40 gram females babies I hatched. The females usually grow another 5 to 10 grams before the eggs are layed anyway.
Waiting to breed at 35 grams is fine but breeding at lower weights doesnt mean it is wrong or is jeopardizing the geckos health.

Eric,

You quoted the range recommended in the "Rhac book" but that doesn't contradict my earlier recommendation. I still say 30 grams isn't the norm, but it's the lower limit of a recommendation.

Allen has posted putting pairs together younger, but he's still just one person. Like many breeders, I'm sure he's had his share of tragedies (a consequence of having a large collection). Do you think he would post on his forum that he had 20 females die egg-bound when he has over 2000? I'm not saying this is true, but I'm saying it to point out that unless you are Allen or work for him, that's something you probably wouldn't know.

I didn't say breeding earlier would equal poor health; I said you would be risking health. I really don't see this as something to argue about. Waiting until the female is 35 grams and 12 months or older has what negative consequence?! You are just one person just like I am one person. We each have our own experiences. I tend to be more conservative (and insist on patience) with my husbandry advice and I just don't see the downside to waiting...

 

[Valley Reptiles]

I wasnt trying to argue, just to point out that breeding before the weight that the rhac book recommends isnt nearly as bad as people say. I've personally had at least a couple hundred females over the years, nothing near Alan's collection and never had a problem with any of them breeding early.

 

[tap1974]

Haroldo, I didn't say I breed mine at 25 grams, I said I've heard of it being done. I also have a few female that never made it to 35 grams even after they were older than a year, what about them do you just not breed them. Some geckos are just small. I have not heard of a female having any problems at 30g. And egg binding is normally from not having a proper nest site for your females. I have talk to countless breeders and read several books including the Rhac book and most say they breed females around 30g to 35g. And with them saying 30 to 35 that makes 30 the low end of the norm and 35 the highend of the norm, 25g is not the norm. Kevin Dunn at Sandfire Dragon Ranch told me that he has had females that breed at 6 months that have never had a problem and he has never even used a scale to check the weights of his geckos. And Kevin was one of the first if not the first to breed crested geckos in North America, so thats like around 15 years of breeding cresteds. Anyway I try to wait until mine are OVER 30g before I breed mine. And with Rubym's female at 34g it is fine to breed her, with one more good meal she'll be 35g anyway. This is my opinion, everone has one. I hope there are no hard feelings.

 

[rubym]

I think you'd be making a mistake breeding her this soon! 25 grams is not only small for a mature female, but she's likely not even sexually mature. What's the rush? With a species that lives 15-20 years, there's alot of reproductive potential ahead of her. Even if she does give you fertile eggs (And that's a BIG if), you'd likely get small hatchlings lacking vigor, and you're risking her health. Why not give it another 6 months, and have a healthy (good-sized) female breed in the early part of summer?

If you haven't gotten it, pick up the Rhacodactylus book by Repashy, Fast, and DeVosjoli. It's not the only way to keeping Rhacodactylus, but i believe the ideals laid out in this book are generally accepted husbandry principles that have yielded the most success in the last decade or so.

She was 34 grams at her vet check last week and parasite free. I have no problem with waiting if thats what I need to do. The book that I have is "Crested Geckos by Adam Black" and it did not go into alot of detail as far as weight and such.

 

[rubym]

. And egg binding is normally from not having a proper nest site for your females. And with Rubym's female at 34g it is fine to breed her, with one more good meal she'll be 35g anyway. This is my opinion, everone has one. I hope there are no hard feelings.

The male that I planned on breeding her with lives in a 3 1/2 foot high X 4 ft wide X 3 ft deep custom enclosure. It has lots of plants and vines and hollow logs ( small ones) to hide in. It has several perches in the back and 2 humidity boxes that I thought she could use as lay boxes. Would that be enough choices for lay sites? For subtrate in his I have a layer of pee gravel WELL COVERED by a layer of vermiculite and bed-a-beast as the top layer. They eat their crickets ( every other night) in a seperate conatiner. He has 2 of the feeding ledges in his tank ( pangea reptile sells them) so no food is ever on the substrate. I will weigh her again tonight. She eats very well. She has CGD ( from pangea reptile) every other night and she eats around 10-12 quarter size crickets ( coated with calcium) every other night. I alternate the CGD and the cricket nights. Once a week I caot 2 or 3 of their crickets with a multivitamin.

 

[goReptiles]

I'd definitely say wait at least a little bit longer. She's of weight, but I like to wait at least 12 months old.

 

[Valley Reptiles]

At 34 grams I would think that she would be older than 8 months. Did the breeder tell you her age?

 

[tap1974]

Yeah 34g at 8 months does not seem right. I have about 7 or 8 at that ago and most are around 20g to 25g at most.

 

[brian547]

so, what do yins wait till gram wise for males usually?

 

[Valley Reptiles]

so, what do yins wait till gram wise for males usually?

Males can breed when their bulge fully drops. Earliest I ever had was 23.5 grams.

 

[elnott]

i personally think it would be safe to house them together now. she will not breed until she is ready. in a cage that large she will be able to get away from him if she wants to. more than likely they will not breed right away any how. i have a trio of 8 month old cresteds living together(have been for a couple months) in a 3't x 2'w x 2'd cage. i personally think it is better to house them together at a younger age that way there is a lesser chance of territorial aggression.