Flukers Brand...

[Paco]

Firstly, after the recent problems with dog food, more companies are now pasteurizing, and more pet owners are buying ONLY pasteurized food.

Now, I interpret the above quote as saying that bacteria will grow in whatever the food is being kept in. If I'm changing the food bi-daily, I would see no problem there. I doubt there's any more harmful bacteria that would grow in the food bowl on it's own than around the cricket crap that already exists in the keeper.

I'm sure that there would be a huge outcry if dog food was contributing to bad health in the geckos of people that use it as a feeder food.

Additionally, I can just about promise you that more bacteria exists on whatever water source or moist fruit you are using in your keeper. It's basic high school biology - bacteria favors dark damp places. Dry dog food is not damp; your common lettuce, carrot, and favorite blue gel are.

Then why was there just a recent out break of Salmonella in humans from eating dog and cat food. I believe it was 9 reported cases. So imagine how many cases are not reported and how many animals this effects?

I am taking the statement to mean that a Bacteria can develop inside of the feeder. Thats the way I read it.

Also i think Maricia might have meant to also mention Parasites/ bacteria but just mentioned Bacteria. Parasites Can exist in this un-pasteurized foods. And can develop in the feeders. The Majority of people buy Cheap food for there dogs and cats proof is in what the grocery stores sell.

 

[lillith]

There are many good gutloads on the market. I think price is the main issue for most people. But most don't realize how important it is for your feeder and animals.

I will be Releasing the ULTIMATE All-IN-ONE GUTLOAD within the next few weeks. It will be the the BEST, MOST nutritional GUTLOAD on the Market bar none. It will Contain all Natural and Organic Human Grade ingredients( No Meat fillers or Sub par products ), as well as the "Ultimate" Fruit and Vegetable Powders( see my add in the classifieds for this Awesome product). No short cuts here either. Lets just say that if people had a diet that was this Nutritional they would be much healthier and happier. So imagine what it can do for your animals. Contact me to get on the Information list and to receive updates on the product.

If you have any questions please fell free to contact me.


Also I see a lot of Cat and dog foods being used as gut load. Meat products are NOT good to use for this. They are low grade and can have all kinds of issues. There are several of the the well know Big breeders here who have said this many times. NO MEAT products. So for those of you who keep using it, Listen to the leader's in the field, they are not trying to steer you wrong.

If Royal Kanin is good enough for my cat and dog (and cat and dog breeders), it's good enough for my geckos' feeder bugs. It's one of the few brands not included in the melamine/other recalls, and as far as I know, has human-grade ingredients.

 

[Paco]

If Royal Kanin is good enough for my cat and dog (and cat and dog breeders), it's good enough for my geckos' feeder bugs. It's one of the few brands not included in the melamine/other recalls, and as far as I know, has human-grade ingredients.

Since when did Geckos become Carnivores? Meat is not a necessary part of their diet so it does not have to be part of your feeders diet. Why not just feed the Geckos the cat and dog food? Or for that matter some big pieces of Raw meat? That is what you are doing, when that is what is feed to your feeder. This is not a Dog or a cat it's a Gecko and none of the Top Gecko breeders uses any sort of cat or dog foods for their feeders. Why would you not listen to them. They are the Leaders in this field? So you take the advice of a Dog breeder about geckos but wont take the advice of a Gecko Breeder about geckos? That just seems odd to me? I am also making this statement to a wide group of people not just 1 person.

 

[lillith]

oh pish-posh. insects aren't meat? *sigh*
~~**to each their own**~~
howza 'bout that?

different people like different solutions and can agree to disagree.
and I know you're not just talking to me, but I'm feeling a tad defensive here.

Have a lovely evening and I hope your recipe works well for you.

 

[SLY]

Then why was there just a recent out break of Salmonella in humans from eating dog and cat food. I believe it was 9 reported cases. So imagine how many cases are not reported and how many animals this effects?
Source, please. I doubt that humans were eating dog and cat food, and secondly, if they were, I would assume the type of person buying dog and cat food for human consumption would be buying the cheap stuff.

I am taking the statement to mean that a Bacteria can develop inside of the feeder. Thats the way I read it.
Wouldn't you see the feeders in a colony dying?

Also i think Maricia might have meant to also mention Parasites/ bacteria but just mentioned Bacteria. Parasites Can exist in this un-pasteurized foods. And can develop in the feeders. The Majority of people buy Cheap food for there dogs and cats proof is in what the grocery stores sell.

By the way, please don't take these as personal attacks against your statements, I'm just arguing for the sake of debate and practicality.

 

[Paco]

By the way, please don't take these as personal attacks against your statements, I'm just arguing for the sake of debate and practicality.

No offense Taken and I dont feel anyone was attacking anyone. That's why I allway's try to mention that I am not talking to one particular person but everyone who is reading!!! I to Like to Debate for the sake of debate!! Never hurts to hear what others have to say and think. Only expands ones knowledge, if they choose to learn from it. :main_thumbsup:

 

[Paco]

oh pish-posh. insects aren't meat? *sigh*
~~**to each their own**~~
howza 'bout that?

different people like different solutions and can agree to disagree.
and I know you're not just talking to me, but I'm feeling a tad defensive here.

Have a lovely evening and I hope your recipe works well for you.

Sorry about that it was not meant as an attack. I just happened to respond to your comment is all. I would have said the same thing to whoever would have wrote that. I knew it would be interpreted that way, thats why I tried to point out I was talking to all, Because there are many that have the same thoughts is all. Once again I am sorry if you felt it was an attack. i forget that it is hard to convey what you are trying to say on the web sometimes.

We all know what we Consider meat. I dont consider a bug meat. Protein yes. Meat No.

As far as bugs eating each other. When you are hungry enough you will eat whatever you can be it Bug or Human.

 

[Paco]

By the way, please don't take these as personal attacks against your statements, I'm just arguing for the sake of debate and practicality.

People have to Eat dog and Cat food all the time. That's why it has to made at the levels it does, because in hard times people resort to it. Someone else mentioned it in another thread about gutload when the same issue about cat and dog food came up.

As for my Source it was a headline on AOL news a few weeks ago. I saw the headline and said WOW. I will see if I can find the article.

http://news.aol.com/health/article/people-still-getting-ill-from-bad-pet/241366

 

[lillith]

Sorry about that it was not meant as an attack. I just happened to respond to your comment is all. I would have said the same thing to whoever would have wrote that. I knew it would be interpreted that way, thats why I tried to point out I was talking to all, Because there are many that have the same thoughts is all. Once again I am sorry if you felt it was an attack. i forget that it is hard to convey what you are trying to say on the web sometimes.

We all know what we Consider meat. I dont consider a bug meat. Protein yes. Meat No.

As far as bugs eating each other. When you are hungry enough you will eat whatever you can be it Bug or Human.

Alright, alright.
They aren't meat. Here ya go, here's your proof:


Mealworm Cookies

Ingredients:
550 ml (1-1/4 cups?) all-purpose flour
5 ml (1 tsp.) baking soda
5 ml (1 tsp.) salt
250 ml (1 cup) softened butter
175 ml (3/4 cup) white sugar
125 ml (1/2 cup) crumbled dried mealworms
175 ml (3/4 cup) firmly packed brown sugar
5 ml (1 tsp.) vanilla
2 eggs
360 grams (1-1/2 cups) chocolate chips

Place the cleaned and prepared insects on a cookie sheet and dry in the oven for 1 -2 hours at 100¡C (200¡F). Preheat oven to 190¡C (375¡F). In a bowl, mix the flour, baking soda and salt. In another bowl, cream butter, white sugar, brown sugar, and vanilla. Stir in eggs. Gradually add the flour mixture. Stir in chocolate chips and mealworms. Drop by teaspoonfuls onto a cookie sheet, and bake 8- 10 minutes.

Mealworm Canapes

Ingredients:
85 ml (1/3 cup) mealworm larvae, slightly thawed
2 garlic cloves, finely chopped
5 ml (1 tsp.) tomato paste
15 ml (1 Tbsp) olive oil
5 ml (1 tsp.) lemon juice
5 ml (1 tsp.) red wine vinegar
plus: red wine vinegar, freshly ground pepper, loaf of French bread (baguette), finely chopped fresh parsley

With a mortar and pestle or in a blender, mash the mealworms, garlic and tomato paste into a puree. Stirring constantly (or with the blender running), add the oil, a few drops at a time. Add the lemon juice, wine vinegar and pepper. Cut the baguette into 1.5 cm slices. Under the broiler, toast one side of the bread slices, and spread the untoasted side with the mixture. Place the canapŽs on a baking sheet and bake at 200¡C (400¡F) for 10 minutes. Sprinkle with parsley.

Siu Mai

Ingredients:
250 ml (1 cup) mealworms
4 water chestnuts
60 ml (4 Tbsp) green onions, sliced
125 ml (1/2 cup) bamboo shoots
1 egg
5 ml (1 tsp.) salt
23 ml (1 - I/2 Tbsp) soy sauce
30 ml (2 Tbsp) sherry
5 ml (1 tsp.) sugar
23 ml (1 1/2 tsp.) cornstarch
1 ml (1/4 tsp.) pepper
plus: wonton wrappers, dipping sauce (see below), vegetable oil

Place mealworms in blender, and grind until paste-like. Chop water chestnuts and add mealworm paste, green onions, bamboo shoots, egg, salt, soy sauce, sherry, sugar, cornstarch and pepper. Mix well. Fill center of won ton wrapper with 30 ml (2 tsp.) of mixture. Fold won ton in shape of a triangle. Moisten finger tips, and seal edges. Fold creased corners backward and secure the ends with more water. (They should now be shaped as a bishop's cap.) Place in skillet containing oil heated to about 350 degrees Fahrenheit. Fry for about 5 minutes. Serve with Dipping Sauce.

Dipping Sauce:

15 ml (1 tsp.) boiling water
15 ml (1 tsp.) mustard
15 ml (1 tsp.) vinegar
30 ml (2 tsp.) soy sauce
Add boiling water to mustard and mix well. Add vinegar and soy sauce. Stir well.


p.s. no hard feelings.

 

[Paco]

Alright, alright.
They aren't meat. Here ya go, here's your proof:


Mealworm Cookies

Ingredients:
550 ml (1-1/4 cups?) all-purpose flour
5 ml (1 tsp.) baking soda
5 ml (1 tsp.) salt
250 ml (1 cup) softened butter
175 ml (3/4 cup) white sugar
125 ml (1/2 cup) crumbled dried mealworms
175 ml (3/4 cup) firmly packed brown sugar
5 ml (1 tsp.) vanilla
2 eggs
360 grams (1-1/2 cups) chocolate chips

Place the cleaned and prepared insects on a cookie sheet and dry in the oven for 1 -2 hours at 100¡C (200¡F). Preheat oven to 190¡C (375¡F). In a bowl, mix the flour, baking soda and salt. In another bowl, cream butter, white sugar, brown sugar, and vanilla. Stir in eggs. Gradually add the flour mixture. Stir in chocolate chips and mealworms. Drop by teaspoonfuls onto a cookie sheet, and bake 8- 10 minutes.

Mealworm Canapes

Ingredients:
85 ml (1/3 cup) mealworm larvae, slightly thawed
2 garlic cloves, finely chopped
5 ml (1 tsp.) tomato paste
15 ml (1 Tbsp) olive oil
5 ml (1 tsp.) lemon juice
5 ml (1 tsp.) red wine vinegar
plus: red wine vinegar, freshly ground pepper, loaf of French bread (baguette), finely chopped fresh parsley

With a mortar and pestle or in a blender, mash the mealworms, garlic and tomato paste into a puree. Stirring constantly (or with the blender running), add the oil, a few drops at a time. Add the lemon juice, wine vinegar and pepper. Cut the baguette into 1.5 cm slices. Under the broiler, toast one side of the bread slices, and spread the untoasted side with the mixture. Place the canapŽs on a baking sheet and bake at 200¡C (400¡F) for 10 minutes. Sprinkle with parsley.

Siu Mai

Ingredients:
250 ml (1 cup) mealworms
4 water chestnuts
60 ml (4 Tbsp) green onions, sliced
125 ml (1/2 cup) bamboo shoots
1 egg
5 ml (1 tsp.) salt
23 ml (1 - I/2 Tbsp) soy sauce
30 ml (2 Tbsp) sherry
5 ml (1 tsp.) sugar
23 ml (1 1/2 tsp.) cornstarch
1 ml (1/4 tsp.) pepper
plus: wonton wrappers, dipping sauce (see below), vegetable oil

Place mealworms in blender, and grind until paste-like. Chop water chestnuts and add mealworm paste, green onions, bamboo shoots, egg, salt, soy sauce, sherry, sugar, cornstarch and pepper. Mix well. Fill center of won ton wrapper with 30 ml (2 tsp.) of mixture. Fold won ton in shape of a triangle. Moisten finger tips, and seal edges. Fold creased corners backward and secure the ends with more water. (They should now be shaped as a bishop's cap.) Place in skillet containing oil heated to about 350 degrees Fahrenheit. Fry for about 5 minutes. Serve with Dipping Sauce.

Dipping Sauce:

15 ml (1 tsp.) boiling water
15 ml (1 tsp.) mustard
15 ml (1 tsp.) vinegar
30 ml (2 tsp.) soy sauce
Add boiling water to mustard and mix well. Add vinegar and soy sauce. Stir well.


p.s. no hard feelings.

Just because someone eats something does not make it meat. People use silk worms the same way. They are not meat. People have used a Varitey of Insects this way for 1000's of years. You are not showing me anything new. They are not meat. A least not what I consider meat and most Americans consider meat. As I said before an excellent source of protein!!!


But like you said " Pish-posh, to each their own"

 

[lillith]

But I just said they ~weren't meat~
...ya silly!

...although I do wonder what category shrimp and other shellfish are considered now?

I think shellfish goes in the "tasty" category.

Mr. Paco, I am detecting a distinct lack of a met humor quota in your life. Please go watch some Monty Python or Steve Martin or Robin Williams or Daily Show or whatever makes you giggle. I really was not trying to be difficult here.

 

[Paco]

But I just said they ~weren't meat~
...ya silly!

...although I do wonder what category shrimp and other shellfish are considered now?

I think shellfish goes in the "tasty" category.

Mr. Paco, I am detecting a distinct lack of a met humor quota in your life. Please go watch some Monty Python or Steve Martin or Robin Williams or Daily Show or whatever makes you giggle. I really was not trying to be difficult here.

Sorry, been way to stressed as of late. I forgot to mention that earlier. so I am easily fired up right now.

I do not like British humor at all. So it wouldn't help. The others will put a smile on my face from time to time.

Hey I like it when people challenge me wether they are serious or it's in fun, it makes me think and keeps me on my toes.

Plus I have friends who are Vegans and all their BS about meat being murder gets me fired up. They are Sprout Killers and I tell them so.

Again sorry my sense of humor is very low right now.