Leiah sleeps outside

[vear]

So, my leo doesn't sleep inside her hides! She sleeps on them haha. She goes in them at night and peeks her head out but only for a while. The rest of the time she sleeps either outside in the middle of the floor or on top of the warm side hide.

I have no lamps for her only a UTH. Is this normal? :main_huh: A while back I had made her a hide but she never went in it :main_rolleyes:. I thought it was too open so I made her another one. It's very private, it's pretty much a rectangular shape with an entrance. She uses it, but only in passing. When she's shedding she does sleep in her humid hide though.

Everything else is normal, she looks good, she's growing (she's about 5months), eating, pooping, etc. I'm not very concerned but i'm wondering why she does that?

--By the way, you can see her by clicking on the link to my signature. On the first picture she's on top of her hide.

 

[Fencer04]

Sounds like you have everything setup right so I wouldn't worry. She is probably just more comfortable outside for now. My geckos stay in their hide most of the time except one or two that will sleep outside them when it's quiet.

 

[GothicGurrrl]

Wow I clicked on your link on your signature. did you take all those photos? they are beautiful what kind of camera do you have??

 

[Dog Shrink]

The only thing that comes to mind for me, aside of the fact that she just may prefer it that way, is that the temps in her hot hide may just be too hot. Do you have a probe thermometer in there to keep accurate temperature readings? That's the first thing I'd check. If so what are your temperatures ranging?

 

[prettyinpink]

I'm thinking the same thing as Kel. Usually...you don't hear of too many geckos wanting to sleep on the outside of their hides. You sure the temps are right? Make sure you're using a temp probe for the most accurate way to measure it. Could be too hot or just not hot enough.

 

[Dog Shrink]

She isn't using lamps Erica so really don't think it could be because it's not hot enough altho maybe it could. Look at what the leo is doing. Laying on top, avoiding what could be the hotter part of the hide yet still getting the belly heat esp. if the hide is TOO hot for her to tolerate on the inside. I doubt the ambient airoutside the hide is warmer than what's going on inside if there is a uth under the hide. Sounds to me more like escape/avoidance behavior honestly. I agree tho the only way to know for sure is an accurately placed probe.

 

[vear]

I'm using a probe thermometer. The probe is sitting on the floor inside the hide. It reads 96F. I can't turn it down any lower, it's as low as it goes, hmm, maybe she's too hot? I'm using those fake tiles as a substrate, although under that I have repticarpet so that it doesn't get too hot. Maybe I can put something else under it to make it cooler?

Thanks for the replies, and by the way, yes I took those pictures, I have a Canon XSI. It's the kit lens though so it's not great, but maybe next year I'll get myself a better one =)

 

[prettyinpink]

Hmm well that's not too hot that's about perfect.

 

[vear]

Yeah - but now i'm thinking it could be hotter during the day when I'm not home. I mean, I live in an apartment complex so I can't regulate the heat in here. Now I'm paranoid. I think i'll add something under the substrate anyway, I can always turn up the UTH, I just can't lower it anymore.

 

[Dog Shrink]

If you read the post by Designer geckos regarding temperature needs 96 would be entirely too hot. Lemme see if I can find the post...

http://geckoforums.net/showthread.php?t=69992

In post #3 Ray goes into some very interesting and great detail about the most beneficial temperature ranges for leos. Since I took his advice, dropped my temps Eros seems MUCH happier.

Again leos are like people... some like it warmer, some like it cooler. The only way to know for sure it to experiemnt a bit and find your leo's ideal range. Hotter doesn't always mean better.

Maybe consider pickiing up a ceramic tile for a thicker more heat resistant substrait, or you could add a couple pieces of thick cardboard under the repticarpet for more of a thermal barrier.

 

[vear]

Thanks everybody! I actually added some cardboard under the substrate last night and dropped the temp. to about 90-91F. She stayed in her hide until I went to bed!! Now this morning she's back outside and the temp. is 93F. I guess she doesn't like it too hot. I'm gonna see if I have time to pick up some tile so I can stop adding cardboard under her substrate! I think 93F might still be too hot for her.

So you guys recommend ceramic tile? I hope I get it cut to the perfect dimensions for my 10gal tank! How do you guys measure? I notice that the silicone in the corners of the tank takes a few millimeters off. Do you measure the inside and then cut it a tad smaller?

 

[roger]

Thanks everybody! I actually added some cardboard under the substrate last night and dropped the temp. to about 90-91F. She stayed in her hide until I went to bed!! Now this morning she's back outside and the temp. is 93F. I guess she doesn't like it too hot. I'm gonna see if I have time to pick up some tile so I can stop adding cardboard under her substrate! I think 93F might still be too hot for her.

So you guys recommend ceramic tile? I hope I get it cut to the perfect dimensions for my 10gal tank! How do you guys measure? I notice that the silicone in the corners of the tank takes a few millimeters off. Do you measure the inside and then cut it a tad smaller?

93 deg is perfect.She will nudge over to where her desired temp is.PPl get too hung up on a perfect temp.Any where between 90-98 is fine.The beautiful thing about leos is they thermoregulate to find the proper heat for them.Dont mess with the temps so much.She will find the desired temps.

 

[Dog Shrink]

When measureing for the tile size you want to measure the inside edges of teh tank and make adjustments for the silicon or simply cutoff some of the protruding silicon that isn't needed since you prob. won't be filling the tank with water. I found that the silicon in my 20 long also was a problem and I ended up hagint to take abut 1/4 inch off the vinyl tiles I used to compendate for that factor.

As far as what to use, like I mentioned I use a high quality slate simulated vinyl tile that is about 1/8 inch thick. You don't want the type you can bend and flex, you want the type that will crack and break if you bend them if you decide to go with vinyl. I prefer the vinyl to ceramic simply because of thethermodynamics of ceramic... they are designed to barrier heat and buffer it (think coffee mug), and teh simple dynamics of ceramic and even natural stone is to disperse heat thru the entire surface of the product rather than to let heat permeate like vinyl does so you end up with a warm area rather than a hot spot. If you go tino my profile and search my thread posts (yes I Know there's a lot of them but there are recent ones that are going to be helpful) there are A LOT of threads where the topic of tile substrait is discussed which should give you a lot better idea of how it functions so you can make an informed decision.

@ Roger... Sorry hon but I have to disagree with the higher end of your temp range. After much debate and research and observing my own leo I have found that anything over 95-96 impacted his quality of life. When I first read Ray's post on optimum temperature ranges (and after discussing it in great length with my breeder who also suggested 88-91* range) I was like heck no that is WAY too cold, but he/they was/were right. I have him down to 90 now, high end of 93 and he is doing much better. He ate 3 supers last night insted of his standard 1 that he had his last couple feedings & his shed is progressing much better than it had the last 2 failed sheds when his tank ws hotter (ranging 95-99).

Eros is a shy guy and altho you would think they would move to thermoregulate to a cooler environment to avoid over heating he never did. He would simply move from one side of his hot hide to the other insted of actually leaving the hide to find a cooler space even thothere are several other places he could have gone to cool off and hide so it's not always the case that they will move to thermoregulate. And if they do, like the op's leo, she was moving but leaving herself exposed and I believe to some extent maybe stressing or making her less comfortable than if she had a place to hide and fufill her natural instincts. Eros would/will NEVER lay out somehwere exposed, heck he barely lays with hakf his face sticking out of is hide. He isusually in the darkest recesses of his tank.

Again tho like I previously mentioned, some prefer it hotter, some cooler. I think a lot of it might have to do with the temps their breeders had them adjusted to before they were sold. I think a leo raised from a hatchlingin a cooler environment does better in a cooler environment as an adult rather than forcing it to adapt to a hotter environment because the "standard" states. I think heating ranges should be based on each idividual animal and adjusted accordingly to that particular animal. For the op as you have seen just by tweaking your heat she was enjoying her hide a lot more, and just the 1 degree bump was enough to drive her out of the hide again to thermoregulate to a cooler spot. I'm thinking your leo would love a 89-92 range and not be harmed by the lower than "standard recommended temps" imo.

 

[vear]

Thank you all so much, I appreciate the advice.

 

[GothicGurrrl]

Thanks for the replies, and by the way, yes I took those pictures, I have a Canon XSI. It's the kit lens though so it's not great, but maybe next year I'll get myself a better one =)

Awesome! They are really great photos =] And that's a great camera! wish I could afford one of those.. maybe someday lol

 

[clemsonguy1125]

Is the probe part touching the floor or the lip around the probe, this could through it off a few degrees.

 

[gothra]

93 deg is perfect.She will nudge over to where her desired temp is.PPl get too hung up on a perfect temp.Any where between 90-98 is fine.The beautiful thing about leos is they thermoregulate to find the proper heat for them.Dont mess with the temps so much.She will find the desired temps.

Yes, I agree with what Roger said. The key is thermoregulation. There is absolutely no problem, in fact its actually better to have a higher warm spot of 97/98F in the tank. As long as you aren't locating all the hides above the warmest spot and that there are cooler places for the gecko to retreat to. I have my thermostats set to 93F, and there are areas (e.g. edge of rock or right next to the humid hide) that reaches 96-97F. I let my geckos decide for themselves what temps suit them better. There is no one correct way to do things, when you have more experience you'll be able to figure out what is best for your gecko.

 

[roger]

When measureing for the tile size you want to measure the inside edges of teh tank and make adjustments for the silicon or simply cutoff some of the protruding silicon that isn't needed since you prob. won't be filling the tank with water. I found that the silicon in my 20 long also was a problem and I ended up hagint to take abut 1/4 inch off the vinyl tiles I used to compendate for that factor.

As far as what to use, like I mentioned I use a high quality slate simulated vinyl tile that is about 1/8 inch thick. You don't want the type you can bend and flex, you want the type that will crack and break if you bend them if you decide to go with vinyl. I prefer the vinyl to ceramic simply because of thethermodynamics of ceramic... they are designed to barrier heat and buffer it (think coffee mug), and teh simple dynamics of ceramic and even natural stone is to disperse heat thru the entire surface of the product rather than to let heat permeate like vinyl does so you end up with a warm area rather than a hot spot. If you go tino my profile and search my thread posts (yes I Know there's a lot of them but there are recent ones that are going to be helpful) there are A LOT of threads where the topic of tile substrait is discussed which should give you a lot better idea of how it functions so you can make an informed decision.

@ Roger... Sorry hon but I have to disagree with the higher end of your temp range. After much debate and research and observing my own leo I have found that anything over 95-96 impacted his quality of life. When I first read Ray's post on optimum temperature ranges (and after discussing it in great length with my breeder who also suggested 88-91* range) I was like heck no that is WAY too cold, but he/they was/were right. I have him down to 90 now, high end of 93 and he is doing much better. He ate 3 supers last night insted of his standard 1 that he had his last couple feedings & his shed is progressing much better than it had the last 2 failed sheds when his tank ws hotter (ranging 95-99).

Eros is a shy guy and altho you would think they would move to thermoregulate to a cooler environment to avoid over heating he never did. He would simply move from one side of his hot hide to the other insted of actually leaving the hide to find a cooler space even thothere are several other places he could have gone to cool off and hide so it's not always the case that they will move to thermoregulate. And if they do, like the op's leo, she was moving but leaving herself exposed and I believe to some extent maybe stressing or making her less comfortable than if she had a place to hide and fufill her natural instincts. Eros would/will NEVER lay out somehwere exposed, heck he barely lays with hakf his face sticking out of is hide. He isusually in the darkest recesses of his tank.

Again tho like I previously mentioned, some prefer it hotter, some cooler. I think a lot of it might have to do with the temps their breeders had them adjusted to before they were sold. I think a leo raised from a hatchlingin a cooler environment does better in a cooler environment as an adult rather than forcing it to adapt to a hotter environment because the "standard" states. I think heating ranges should be based on each idividual animal and adjusted accordingly to that particular animal. For the op as you have seen just by tweaking your heat she was enjoying her hide a lot more, and just the 1 degree bump was enough to drive her out of the hide again to thermoregulate to a cooler spot. I'm thinking your leo would love a 89-92 range and not be harmed by the lower than "standard recommended temps" imo.

Dog shrink- although leos can tolerate even up to 98- 100 degs I'm not suggesting to keep them at that temp.All i am saying is the leo will not burn at temps that high like some have suggested.Some of my older posts repeatedly suggest anywhere from 88-95 as the optimun temp.Say even if u do keep your temps at 100 deg.Your leo will nudge over to where the animal hits his ideal warming spot.Thats why we call it thermoregulating.u mention the word "forcing" , the leo is not being forced with any kind of heat.Say u have a heat variance of 100 degrees on one end and then a gradual cooling off as u go to the cool end, the leo will choose what temp is suitable to him even though u offered him a temp of 100 deg.it doesnt mean he will lay on the 100 degree spot if its too warm for him he'll move over.Leos will take what they need in regards to heat.Your right each leo is different.As long as the animal eats and defecates thats what counts everyones leos are different.i have a upside warm container which he can move around to get his desired heat.I found for my animals I keep them all at 95 deg under the warm hide and they eat like pigs and i clean their enclosures bi weekly.From my experince with leos and on this forum I have found alot of ppl keep their temps at 95.