Mixing Species

[Halley]

I know some Macks where outcrosses with a some of the sub-species of leopard geckos. The reason this was done is to take out some of the “defect” that the mack snow / super snow morph had. So here are my questions. Why hasn’t this be done with enigmas as of yet? Or has it? And why does it matter if you do it with a different species? If you got wild caught bloodlines (http://www.geckosetc.com/htm/available_wildcaughts.htm) Eublepharis macularius why will this not have the same effect? Will it? Has it been tried, with the Mack, or the enigmas?

The other practically unrelated question I have is. Would anybody else not want a mix species? I don’t think I would really want one. I think it would be nice to keep some things pure. But does this matter to most?

Any responses it appreciated

 

[yellermelon]

It has been done with the enigmas, and is still being done. And will do nothing but help the line.

 

[Halley]

It has been done with the enigmas, and is still being done. And will do nothing but help the line.

With a sub, or macularius?

 

[godzillizard]

I'm 100% positive of Enigma x fasciolatus and afghanicus--And I'm sure they're being bred to every other sub in the country...Em macularius, Em montanus etc. We don't yet know if it will "cleanse" the line--some 'conditions' might be synonymous with certain appearances--like with dog breeds for example

 

[cassadaga]

I think you're looking at it the wrong way. Breeding an enigma to a Fascio isn't depurifying them. All E. Macularis are the same species, sub species really only defines slight differences between localities. Most leopard geckos in the trade are mixed localities, because when the hobby was starting it wasn't important to most herpers.

 

[Ccrashca069]

By mixed species are you talking about out crossing?

 

[paulnj]

I have fasc X enigma and afghanicus X enigmas should hatch soon(2 clutches of non enigma thus far). Matt and Alberto have both and outcrossed subspiecies X enigmas too.

 

[Ccrashca069]

If you take back every morph that was made doing that, there would be only a handfull to pick from. Also it makes a new morph strain stronger.

 

[fallen_angel]

know some Macks where outcrosses with a some of the sub-species of leopard geckos. The reason this was done is to take out some of the “defect” that the mack snow / super snow morph had.

What "defects" did they used to have? Just curious because I have never heard this before and would love to learn.

 

[Nigel4less]

What "defects" did they used to have? Just curious because I have never heard this before and would love to learn.

Alot of Macks and Supers just failed to thrive. Nobody thought they would make it to 45-50 grams breeding weight. Even though I have a few Macks that are around 70-75 grams.

 

[Nigel4less]

Well I think everything should be left pure to some extent. But also if some of these subspecies weren't bred together we wouldn't have some of the amazing mutations we have today. But I am aware of Fasciolatus x Enigma and Afghanicus x Enigma. Hope that helped you out a bit Nick

 

[Halley]

Okay so pretty much all the geckos that are out there right now are from other sub crosses? So more the likely the enigmas I have right now aren’t “pure” they might have some linage of those other subs still in them? So basically it simply doesn’t matter what you do with the species, as the worse thing that can happen is you make stronger healthier babies?

But I guess my question still is, does it matter what species you use?

 

[Halley]

By mixed species are you talking about out crossing?

Basically. Like breeding a fasc to an afghan, etc

 

[fallen_angel]

Alot of Macks and Supers just failed to thrive. Nobody thought they would make it to 45-50 grams breeding weight. Even though I have a few Macks that are around 70-75 grams.

Wow I did not know that, that is very interesting. Do you know anymore about it, like what was causing it to happen?

We have one Mack male that is 116.9 grams and our females are at/around 60 grams :main_yes:

 

[paulnj]

I would love to do fasc X afghanicus... who has a male of either subspecies I can borrow:main_laugh:

 

[Nigel4less]

Wow I did not know that, that is very interesting. Do you know anymore about it, like what was causing it to happen?

We have one Mack male that is 116.9 grams and our females are at/around 60 grams :main_yes:

Simple answer Jess, Inbreeding. If you need anymore information PM me, since this is going off topic.

 

[Halley]

Okay, but should it really matter what species you breed it to? If you breed to a wild caught bloodline of any species, wouldn’t it have the same effects?

If not, why? Does anybody know if this is the case?

 

[Gregg M]

Okay so pretty much all the geckos that are out there right now are from other sub crosses? So more the likely the enigmas I have right now aren’t “pure” they might have some linage of those other subs still in them? So basically it simply doesn’t matter what you do with the species, as the worse thing that can happen is you make stronger healthier babies?

But I guess my question still is, does it matter what species you use?

Not sure what you mean by "pure enigma"... Your enigmas are a genetic mutation, not a subspecies. This and all other leopard gecko gene mutation will be reproduced in all of the leopard gecko subspecies wild caught or captive propagated...

 

[Halley]

Not sure what you mean by "pure enigma"... Your enigmas are a genetic mutation, not a subspecies. This and all other leopard gecko gene mutation will be reproduced in all of the leopard gecko subspecies wild caught or captive propagated...

All I mean by “pure” is that they don’t have other species crossed in there.

But I guess the main thing I want to know now, is does it matter what species you outcross the enigma gene with if you want to get rid of some of the “defects” of the trait?

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

I think one thing that some of you are not understanding here... leopard geckos ARE the same specie, they might just be a different sub-specie or locality.