Need some assistance on IDing medical problem.

[packs_fan]

I have a female tangerine leo that I have owned for about 3 years now. Within in the past 4 months I have noticed a drastic change in her behavior. She does some odd things when she eats, she will shake her head back and fourth which I have never witnessed before. When she is awake I would watch walk back and fourth to her food dish for about 20 to 30 minutes. I have also witnessed her doing some semi circling not too severe but still a little strange to watch. She also has become extremely lethargic only really moving around to eat or go to the bathroom. I have caught her laying on her back at least 4 times now. Also a new development as of today she will jerk her entire body. Lastly the most obvious change is her back legs. She drags them and does not use them when walking. Although when she is trying to eat out of her food dish she has her back legs standing up very tall.

My first natural thought was MBD so I put an abundance of non D3 calcium in with her. I did not see any improvements with her. After no luck I decided to contact the breeder I purchased from to see if there was possibly some enigma genes that I was not told about when purchased. The breeder said there was no enigma that they knew of. After I explained the symptoms of the leo... They did not discount the possibility of enigma syndrome or another neurological issue. They said they would check with the breeders they know and send me a message if they found anything out. I have not received any word from them.

I finally decided to do to the vet and have a checkup and hopefully get some answers. The vet told me that the gecko needed a UV bulb. Also gave me 3 different meds. An antibiotic, a med for parasites, and a med to encourage hunger. As I have never heard of needing to use a UV bulb with a leo I did not do so. He also mentioned she could have stargazing but did not say anymore about it than that.

So at this point I am frustrated and confused about what is wrong with her. I am mostly likely thinking it is neurological but I would love to hear anyone's thoughts on the matter. I would appreciate any ideas. Thanks so much!

 

[acpart]

It sounds neurological to me and I have no idea what you should do. Sorry.

Aliza

 

[indyana]

Are you providing D3 in some fashion?

 

[packs_fan]

Are you providing D3 in some fashion?

Yes I dust my meal worms with repashy every feeding.

 

[indyana]

Okay, just checking.

Your vet seems to be taking a broad spectrum approach to try to knock out any underlying infection that could be exacerbating her issues. I hope that helps control her symptoms, because it does sound like she's gone downhill quite a bit. I don't have any better ideas.

 

[happygeckos3]

Just curious, but are you supposed to give D3 at every feeding if your gecko is 3 y/o? I use a bulb and have the feeders lie under the light and I don't use D3 powder, only calcium powder. I think they can get an overdose of too much D3. So using a bulb on what they eat eliminates the question whether they have had enough D3? Maybe you can try the bulb and see if that would help any. I know my gecko started to drop his food with too much multi vitamin powder. After I stopped giving it to him, he was fine. I also gave him bene bac in case he had an infection. Well good luck and hope she gets well!


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[indyana]

If you're were calcium+D3 powder, you wouldn't dust every feeding, but he specifically said Repashy. Assuming he's referring to Repashy Calcium Plus, that supplement has lower levels of D3 and is designed for use every feeding.

 

[Neon Aurora]

Hmm, insects don't have skin like vertebrates, and don't produce vitamin D the same way vertebrates do (I've actually read that invertebrates don't even need vitamin D, so don't produce it). So having the insects under a UV light wouldn't actually do anything. Gut loading with something rich in vitamin D would work, though.

Supplementing with vitamins is important. Getting a D3 overdose is actually kind of tough. But regardless, Repashy is designed for dusting every feeding, so it's fine.

Perhaps you could take the gecko to a vet and see what they think.

 

[happygeckos3]

In the wild there is no vitamin D supplement powder, so how would they get the vitamin? Just curious...


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[indyana]

I was thinking about this some more, and something else to consider would be whether the gecko or its food could have been exposed to something toxic--random chemicals, pesticides, toxic mold, etc.

 

[indyana]

In the wild there is no vitamin D supplement powder, so how would they get the vitamin? Just curious...

Sunlight (specifically UVB) is the main source of D3 for wild reptiles. While leopard geckos are mainly active at night, they are considered crepuscular and can be seen out before dark. In captivity, you either need to provide them with UVB lighting or give them dietary supplements.

 

[happygeckos3]

I used to give a D3 powder to my geckos but then they started having problems. I added the UVB bulb and feed my giant mealworms fish food, carrots, oats, and sweet potatoes. I also buy horn worms as well. I've noticed with a light, their colors have become more vibrant and they're quite healthy. Hopefully this stays that way. As for the original posting, can you rule out D3 toxicity? They say the symptoms are like MBD.

http://www.repticzone.com/forums/Geckos-Leopard/messages/2203209.html


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[indyana]

Seems unlikely given the description of issues and care. The only symptom that resembles MBD in the post is the leg issue, and even that sounds a bit weird (dragging them part of the time but standing tall on them at other times...).

As Kirsten mentioned, it's pretty tough to cause D3 toxicity in leopard geckos. In fact, I have not seen a confirmed leopard gecko case yet, although I keep it in the back of my mind as possible. There are plenty of people who dust with Repashy Calcium Plus every feeding with no ill effects as well. If there were an intrinsic problem with using that supplement constantly, we would be seeing more issues.

 

[packs_fan]

I was thinking about this some more, and something else to consider would be whether the gecko or its food could have been exposed to something toxic--random chemicals, pesticides, toxic mold, etc.

I had considered this a possibility but it does not explain why only her is suffering from this problem. I have another leo on the exact same diet who is very healthy and shows none of these issues.

 

[packs_fan]

Hmm, insects don't have skin like vertebrates, and don't produce vitamin D the same way vertebrates do (I've actually read that invertebrates don't even need vitamin D, so don't produce it). So having the insects under a UV light wouldn't actually do anything. Gut loading with something rich in vitamin D would work, though.

Supplementing with vitamins is important. Getting a D3 overdose is actually kind of tough. But regardless, Repashy is designed for dusting every feeding, so it's fine.


Perhaps you could take the gecko to a vet and see what they think.

Yes it is repashy calcium plus that I use on my leos. As for vets... The one i have taken him to is the only one anywhere near me. The vet also before I left made a point that having blood work done would be very costly. Basically what I got from the vet was see if these work if not your out of luck unless you want to spend some serious money on finding what is wrong with her.

 

[indyana]

Yeah, vet costs can certainly skyrocket once you get out of the routine care category. :\ I hope that the meds help her out somewhat.

If it is neurological, keeping her enclosure simple/secure and minimizing stress as much as possible could also help. Using Enigma Syndrome as an example, sometimes too much stimulation or stress can bring on episodes.