New owner with a sickie

[insertexpletivehere]

Hi everyone!

I unexpectedly acquired a leopard gecko the other day (long story!). She is sick, spent two days at the vet before bringing her home. She has a nasty eye infection in both eyes and may be blind in one or both eyes, we are treating the infection with saline and an eye ointment. She had a bad shed and had dead skin stuck all over her face and toes, including her eyes - both were sealed shut initially. Her eye goop also crusts over and seals her eyes shut, she's been good about me getting the one open but I haven't been able to get the other open. The one that I can't get open looks deflated, not sure if there is even an eye in there but I have been taking it easy on her so she doesn't get too stressed out as there have been a lot of changes in her life lately.

Since everything was so sudden I know her habitat needs a lot of work. She is currently in a 10 gallon tank with paper towel as substrate. She has a hide on the hot side and one on the cool side, her water dish is on the cool side but somewhat close to the hot side. The hide on the hot side is an artificial rock thing that seems to get decently warm, she does bask on it at times. She only has a lamp for heating right now, temp is right around 92 on the hot side, not sure about the cool side. Humidity fluctuates a bit, right now it is at ~30%. She was not eating or having a bowel movement but did eat some a/d off of fingers at the vets and, after soakings, eventually had a bowel movement. That was tested for parasites and came back negative. She was also offered a/d there, but it would dry out before she would eat any of it. She was offered crickets for about a day at the vet's but didn't eat any. At the vet she was in a 10 gallon tank at about 95 degrees, paper towel substrate, water dish, a/d and no hide. She was soaked twice a day.

She tolerates handling very well, if I put my hand in the tank she will usually come out, sometimes running onto my hand and up my arm. She has been much more active than she was initially (would just sit there and let you do anything). Now she's putting up a bit of a fuss when I give her a bath or attempt to do anything to her eyes - I am hoping this means she is starting to feel better and willing to fight with treatment. She will only eat crickets if I take their legs off, I think this is partly because she can't really see them at all with her eye issues. I am leaving the crickets in with her - 2 at a time - for now because they don't go into her hides and I want her to eat when she's comfortable rather than me standing here staring at her and making things even more stressful.

A few questions I have that I hope you don't mind answering (I have browsed the forums quite a bit but am feeling a bit overwhelmed and confused):
1) Should I keep the tank changes to a minimum right now and just slowly add things to reduce the stress? I would like to upgrade her to a bigger tank (15-20 gallon) but she has had SO much going on lately.
2) I know I need to get an under tank heater but she seems to be doing alright with the set up right now - how urgent is this? If possible, I would like to wait until next week (pay day), but may be able to get sooner. She is having small bowel movements.
3) Is it likely that the lamp heat is causing her eye to crust more because it's coming from above (heating the air as well)?
4) How do I tell how old she is? I have absolutely no idea and forgot to ask the vet. She is about 4" long.
5) Should I be tempting her with food other than crickets? She has eaten one that I picked the legs off and I saw her drag another into her hide but not sure if she's eaten it yet.
6) When I was cleaning her eye this morning she opened her mouth at me but didn't try to bite or hiss. I assume this was a warning and I did back off a bit, but at the same time needed to finish up with her eye. Was it a warning? Do gecko bites hurt?
7) What is her quality of life if she does end up being blind in both eyes? Do I just plug along until she starts going downhill?
8) Should I be more active in trying to get the sunken eye open? I know it stresses her but if it's infected as well, it should be cleared out right?

Thanks for the help! Having this little girl has been fascinating for me. Hopefully she will pull through and make it.

 

[indyana]

Welcome! I'll try to answer a few of your questions right off the bat, but you may get more replies posting some of these questions in the forums inside the Leopard Gecko forum (it's in the Gecko Forums section of the main forum page and has lots of sub-forums for various topics).

1) I would keep her in a smaller tank for now, especially if she has vision issues. It will be easier for her to learn her way around and not add more stress in her current condition. Also, you mentioned that she's only 4", and young geckos do better in smaller spaces.

2) I would definitely get an under tank heater eventually, as bright heat lamps can stress out these nocturnal geckos, but as long as she has a warm spot with a surface temp around 90 F to digest her food, she should be okay until you can get one. You'll probably need a thermostat to control the heat pad as well. I recommend getting a reptile temp gun to measure surface temps--extremely handy when keeping reptiles.

3) The hot air might be contributing to the eye crust, but she'll probably have goopy eyes until they heal properly.

4) She is certainly a juvenile at 4", but telling exact age can be tricky if the gecko has been malnourished. This might be a good question to post with a picture or two in the Leopard Gecko forums.

5) Food variety is always good, so you should definitely rotate food sources when you can. It not only provides more complete nutrition but also keeps the gecko engaged in feeding.

6) Yes, open mouths are a warning, and yes, getting bitten can hurt. Luckily, leopard geckos aren't that large, so there is a limit to the damage they can do, and most of them are not aggressive. I'd just watch her body language and be careful where your fingers are in relation to her mouth if she starts to look angry.

7) Leopard geckos are really hardy and can get along quite well, even with disabilities such as blindness. She may need a smaller/safer cage and a bit of help feeding depending how much eyesight she loses, but provided she pulls through this initial recovery period, she could still have a long life ahead of her.

8) I would call the vet for advice regarding her eye and whether you should be trying to open it or not.

Reading through your post, I'm really glad to hear that you're doing your best to take care of this very sick gecko. They are really wonderful little creatures, so I hope that she will recover well. The only thing I read that I really would caution against is leaving the crickets in her cage. I would feed under supervision only, with tongs if that seems to help, and if you would really like her to have full-time access to food during her recovery, get a dish and put something like mealworms, phoenix worms, or mealworm pupae in it. I didn't see any mention of supplements. For feeder insects, you should always gutload (feed them something highly nutritious) for at least a day before feeding to your gecko and dust them with calcium and multivitamin supplements. I like Repashy Calcium Plus because it's an all-in-one dust that can be used every feeding, but there are many other options.

Olympus made a great post recently regarding nutritious things to feed insects before you give them to your gecko:
http://geckoforums.net/f128-feeding-feeders/99818.htm#post793449

 

[insertexpletivehere]

Thanks for the info! I was able to get in touch with one of my friends that has a bunch of snakes/reptiles (including geckos!). She suggested out the lamp for an UTH, so I went and got that today. The light was more than likely making her eyes worse (drying them out). While I was out I also got an artificial plant hide that sticks to the side, I have it in the cool side and she's been in an out a couple of times.

I got her a better dish today, if I pick the legs off the crickets they can't get out. Would the risk of them nibbling on her still be there? She won't eat if I'm near the tank, which is why I was leaving them in there overnight. I bought some waxworms today to hopefully entice her. I'm going to order some Carnivore Care tomorrow, it'll be in on Tuesday.

Her closed eye opened today during her evening bath. It's when I'm doing something on that side that she seems to get angry and open her mouth. Some pus came out initially but I flushed it with saline and put the ointment on it. Her other eye seems to be doing a bit better, it's less neon than it was and I'm starting to see what I think is her actual eye underneath... but I may be seeing things.

She had a lot of changes today but she seems to be coping well, she explored for a little bit and is now hanging out in her warm hide. I'm going to make a humid hide for her tomorrow after work.

I'll definitely post in the other section as well, thanks!

 

[indyana]

Good to hear that she's doing all right. As long as you are very certain the crickets cannot escape from the dish and you continue to monitor them, they won't be able to hurt your gecko. I would be extremely sparing with the waxworms. Geckos love them, to the point where they can start refusing to eat other foods, and waxworms are not very nutritious. Most people use them as occasional treats only.

That eye is probably very painful for her, but it sounds like the treatments are helping. Keep up the great work!

 

[Olympus]

It's so nice of you to have taken her on!

Last year I rescued a chameleon that was a neglect case and she came to me with a respiratory infection and stomatitis (mouth rot), and an infection in one eye. Chameleons get stressed very easily but the routine to get her better depending on wrapping her up in a towel and having someone hold her while I scraped out all the buildup in her mouth, the gunk in her eye, treated both areas with their respective medicines, and gave her antibiotics via syringe. It was A LOT for one poor animal to go through daily for a few weeks, but the alternative was letting her die so when we weighed the options it was clear that it was better for her to endure the stress, try to do it as quickly as humanly possible, and to put her back after and try to leave her alone.

And now she's healthy, living like a queen on a free range set-up, is super sweet, and is back to health (although her one eye never recovered 100%, and is a little cloudy. She can see but not perfectly)

So what I'm saying is that she's not going to like it right now, but geckos are hardy little creatures, and she'll be better off in the long-run if you can try and clean out any infection gunk as quickly as possible. The longer it lingers in an area the more it can fester and cause damage, so I would try and clean out that eye if possible. These types of infections can be fairly aggressive, so you have to be just as persistent cleaning things out and making sure the medicine can reach the affected areas.

Best of luck!

 

[insertexpletivehere]

I thought I should probably link to my post in Health and Medications as well, there are some pictures of her there too. You can also see the big glob of crusty goop that came out of her eye if you wish by going there, lol.
http://geckoforums.net/f130-health-medications/99927.htm

You have all been so helpful so far and I am extremely thankful. You've eased my mind a bit and I'm not (quite as) paranoid about looking in her tank and finding her dead. She is such a good girl too - very tame and easy to work with. She absolutely fascinates me with every move, something I hope doesn't wear off!

I'm off to give her her night soak and eye treatment. I've been trying to take pictures as I go to better see the progress. I will most likely just update the other thread in Health from now on.

Thank you all again so much!

 

[insertexpletivehere]

I said I wasn't going to update this thread but didn't really see these properly last night (I've been having some long days with work and caring for this little girl!)

Good to hear that she's doing all right. As long as you are very certain the crickets cannot escape from the dish and you continue to monitor them, they won't be able to hurt your gecko. I would be extremely sparing with the waxworms. Geckos love them, to the point where they can start refusing to eat other foods, and waxworms are not very nutritious. Most people use them as occasional treats only.

That eye is probably very painful for her, but it sounds like the treatments are helping. Keep up the great work!

She did get bitten by one of the crickets that I had left in there, apparently I missed taking it's legs off (or it jumped out of the container and I didn't notice). It's legs have since been removed and the spot where it bit at her is looking alright - I'm keeping an eye on it though just incase. I bought the waxworms to just get her eating something, at the time I wasn't sure when she had last eaten and she was only eating very, very tiny bits of a/d at the vet. I figured I'd give her some "candy" to stimulate her appetite. I was talking to her old owner today, she used to refuse to eat anything other than waxworms so I suspect that she was quite fat/overweight before going on a hunger strike and that's why she's an ok weight now. Apparently her tail was twice the size it currently is.

It's so nice of you to have taken her on!

Last year I rescued a chameleon that was a neglect case and she came to me with a respiratory infection and stomatitis (mouth rot), and an infection in one eye. Chameleons get stressed very easily but the routine to get her better depending on wrapping her up in a towel and having someone hold her while I scraped out all the buildup in her mouth, the gunk in her eye, treated both areas with their respective medicines, and gave her antibiotics via syringe. It was A LOT for one poor animal to go through daily for a few weeks, but the alternative was letting her die so when we weighed the options it was clear that it was better for her to endure the stress, try to do it as quickly as humanly possible, and to put her back after and try to leave her alone.

And now she's healthy, living like a queen on a free range set-up, is super sweet, and is back to health (although her one eye never recovered 100%, and is a little cloudy. She can see but not perfectly)

So what I'm saying is that she's not going to like it right now, but geckos are hardy little creatures, and she'll be better off in the long-run if you can try and clean out any infection gunk as quickly as possible. The longer it lingers in an area the more it can fester and cause damage, so I would try and clean out that eye if possible. These types of infections can be fairly aggressive, so you have to be just as persistent cleaning things out and making sure the medicine can reach the affected areas.

Best of luck!

She really doesn't seem to mind me doing things to her eyes, although the one does bother her more than the other and she lets me know by opening her mouth when she's had enough. It's at that point that I know to hurry up and then let her be for a bit. We have a bit of a routine going since I've figured this out. I'll do her "good" eye first, get out any gunk that's in there and flush it, then put her medication in. Then it's onto the "bad" eye. I have to pry it open, flush it and then put the medication in. It's usually between the prying open and flushing it that she starts to get angry. I'm sure it hurts that I have to open it for her, I try to be as gentle as possible. What I've been doing that seems to work a bit better is putting a damp piece of warm gauze over that eye while I work on the "good" one, this loosens up any crusties that are on there and makes the eyelids easier to separate, it may also make the infection come towards the surface, but that might just be coincidence. I got quite a bit more gunk out of the "good" eye yesterday, I'm going to post about that now because I'm not really liking what I'm seeing

 

[Olympus]

What I've been doing that seems to work a bit better is putting a damp piece of warm gauze over that eye while I work on the "good" one, this loosens up any crusties that are on there and makes the eyelids easier to separate, it may also make the infection come towards the surface, but that might just be coincidence.

That's a really smart idea! Clever thinking.