Question about Black Hole ...

[mika-13]

Hi @ all.

I can´t reach Chris from genetic calculator, so I try it now by posting in the forum. I hope that´s o.k. so.

In Germany we are the opinion that a Mack Snow Eclipse Enigma is also a Black Hole, but in Chris calculator (see below) it is difference. But I think - the both combinations below should to be the same and both geckos are Black Holes? What´s the difference in the calculator? Why is this so?

I hope you will understand my question, my english is not so good. Thanks, Micha.

The genetic calculator says:

BEE 1 Copy X mack snow eclipse:

25% Mack Snow Enigma (1 Copy) Eclipse
25% Enigma (1 Copy) Eclipse
25% Eclipse
25% Mack Snow Eclipse


and BEE 1 Copy X mack snow enigma 1 copy het eclipse:

6.25% Mack Snow Enigma (2 Copy) het Eclipse
6.25% Enigma (2 Copy) het Eclipse
12.5% Mack Snow Enigma (1 Copy) Eclipse
12.5% Mack Snow Enigma (1 Copy) het Eclipse
12.5% Enigma (1 Copy) Eclipse
12.5% Enigma (1 Copy) het Eclipse
6.25% Mack Snow het Eclipse
6.25% Eclipse
6.25% Normal het Eclipse
6.25% Black Hole (2 Copy Enigma Variant)
6.25% BEE (2 Copy Enigma Variant)
6.25% Mack Snow Eclipse

 

[Northstar Herp]

IF your question is why don't the two scenarios have the same results, then the BEE 1 Copy is not a mack snow, and the mack snow eclipse is not an enigma in the first set, and in the second one you still have the same non-mack BEE paired with the copy mack enigma HET eclipse. It's a different pairing, hence different results.

However, if your question is instead about lines 3 and 10 in the second scenario, then maybe they just listed it different in the calculator. The only difference appears to be 1 copy enigma vs. 2 copy.

 

[RampantReptiles]

I think his question is why is a Mack Snow Eclipse Enigma not called a Black hole when they are the same thing.

It must have something to do with the copy 1 and copy 2, which I dont really understand myself.

Maybe the computer program is not programmed properly and gives not complete results. I say it is accurate enough, it gives the genetic possibilities and just leave it at that.

Also that program is from the UK is it not?

 

[mika-13]

@ RampantReptiles:

Yes, that´s the question: both must have the name "Black holes" at the end.

It is the milliondollargeckos morph calculator from UK. A friend in German forum was asking why a Mack Snow Eclipse Enigma not is a Black Hole after trying this calculator. In Germany we think that a Mack Snow Eclipse Enigma called also Black hole. And so he thought there is still a difference.

I tried to explain him also that the only difference appears to be 1 copy enigma vs. 2 copy. But I can´t explain him why it is so.

 

[RampantReptiles]

Ok I read on the other morph calculator that 1 copy is heterozygous form and 2 copy is homozygous.

It is listing the Mack Snow eclipse enigma 1 copy separately from a Black Hole 2 copy. They are the same because there is no het or homo enigma, it is a dominate trait.

1 copy versus 2 copy is important for other morphs but not enigmas.

So like I said before the computer program is not smart enough to realize they are the same because it was not programmed that way. Computer programs are only as smart as they are programmed to be, I have a bachelors degree in Computer Science so I am a pretty well informed source.

 

[mika-13]

Thanks for answers. ;-)

 

[Northstar Herp]

1 copy vs. 2 copy enigmas are important, but you don't know which you have until you breed them. A 2 copy enigma parent will produce all enigma babies. I was told this by the guy who wrote the million dollar calculator, because I was wondering exactly what a copy and copy 2 enigma was. It's dominant, so there's not HET, but there is a difference in the results between the two.

You got me as to why the 1 copy vs. 2 copy isn't called a black hole.

 

[RampantReptiles]

really? a 2 copy enigma produces all enigmas? I didnt know that...
They would produce all 1 copy enigmas unless you bred two 2 copy enigmas or two 1 copy enigmas could produce 2 copy enigmas but you would not know without test breeding. Wow run-on sentence.

Sorry to go off topic but I was wondering is the whole dont breed 2 enigmas or you will get all messed up enigmas a spoof or no longer true? I thought I read this somewhere and was telling someone else and they didnt really believe me but I could not find proof. If you could show me where someone has written this that would be great!

 

[Tony C]

It's dominant, so there's not HET, but there is a difference in the results between the two.

That is a common misconception. Heterozygous means that the organism in question carries one copy of a particular gene, whether that gene is dominant, recessive, or codom/incomplete dominant. A "1 copy" Enigma is a heterozygous Enigma, and a "2 copy" Enigma is a homozygous Enigma.


As for the calculator, that is probably just a bug in the program, a Mack Snow Enigma Eclipse is indeed a Black Hole, whether heterozygous or homozygous Enigma.

 

[RampantReptiles]

There is a het it is just visual because the gene is dominate. Unlike with some other morphs, especially recessive morphs, in which the het is not visible.

I understand now

 

[Tony C]

There is a het it is just visual because the gene is dominate. Unlike with some other morphs, especially recessive morphs, in which the het is not visible.

I understand now

That is correct. The word "carrier" may also be used to refer specifically to an organism heterozygous for a recessive trait.

 

[richardrojas]

really? a 2 copy enigma produces all enigmas? I didnt know that...
They would produce all 1 copy enigmas unless you bred two 2 copy enigmas or two 1 copy enigmas could produce 2 copy enigmas but you would not know without test breeding. Wow run-on sentence.

Sorry to go off topic but I was wondering is the whole dont breed 2 enigmas or you will get all messed up enigmas a spoof or no longer true? I thought I read this somewhere and was telling someone else and they didnt really believe me but I could not find proof. If you could show me where someone has written this that would be great!

If you cross a 2 copy enigma with a 1 copy enigma you will have a 75% to produce a 2 copy enigma and 25% of a 1 copy enigma. If you cross a 1 copy enigma with a 1 copy enigma you will have a 25% of producing a 2 copy enigma, 50% 1 copy of enigma and 25% for non enigma. I think that why they don't call to the Mack Snow Eclipse Enigma (1 copy) a Black Hole might be since if you cross two Mack Snow Eclipse Enigma (1 copy) you have a 25% chance of not producing a Black Hole and you are expecting to get all black holes babies. Let me know if I am wrong with my genetics.

 

[Northstar Herp]

That is a common misconception. Heterozygous means that the organism in question carries one copy of a particular gene, whether that gene is dominant, recessive, or codom/incomplete dominant. A "1 copy" Enigma is a heterozygous Enigma, and a "2 copy" Enigma is a homozygous Enigma.


As for the calculator, that is probably just a bug in the program, a Mack Snow Enigma Eclipse is indeed a Black Hole, whether heterozygous or homozygous Enigma.

Yeah, that's right, I think I remember the dude saying something like that now that you mention it. Thanks for the clarification.