Questions re RAPTOR genetics & Poll

[tangerineman]

I have been seeing a lot of comments (sales pitches) on websites regarding the patterns produced by various RAPTOR x RAPTOR crossings, but one that seems to be common goes something like this:
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RAPTORS; jungle, striped, reverse stripe VERY RARE!!!
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now, my understanding as far as what a RAPTOR is supposed to be is that it is PATTERNLESS to some varying degree...

I would also think that maybe the 'patternless' part of it, would make it MORE valuable, and from my viewing I would say that I have found it far more rare to actually see RAPTORS w/o any pattern or spots on the body...
I undertstand that beauty if subjective, and believe me i like stripes and reverse stripes as much as anyone...

ok, lol, so here's my questions, please contribute to this, thanks....

-Duane

 

[GroovyGeckos.com]

Patternless and Reverse Stripe "Raptors" were the first to be released/created, making the other types more "rare". Fully Patternless geckos are something, that in itself can be considered "rare", because alot of "Patternless Stripe" (Aptor)types have some pattern.

It took longer for the Jungle/Aberrant "Raptors", and I`m not sure there have been many Striped "Raptors".

When I type "Raptor" in quotes, I only refer to the eyes, the pattern has nothing to do with what some people call Raptors.

EXAMPLE: "Jungle Raptor" would be incorrect, what it should be called is a "Ruby Eyed Jungle Albino".

 

[okapi]

Why limit the eclipsed gene to just 'patternless' albinos?
RERS blow RAPTORs out of the water.

 

[tangerineman]

not sure if you mean red eyed reverse stripe, or red eyed red stripe,

eitehr way, i'd like those as well, this question is more about terminology and what is accepted as normal or rare by the general consensus,

now I know from my personal eclipse, and reverse stripe x stripe breedings, that a rev stripe eclipse eye is way more rare than a normal eclipse....
NOT a eclipse HET, as I produced several of these, but one with a rev stripe AND the eclipse eyes....

 

[malt_geckos]

I think he meant Red-eyed Reverse Stripe....That's usually associated with the Eclipse gene... more so than a Red-eyed Red stripe.. I love all of the RAPTORS and the leos that have the Red-eyes. Just one thing that really bothers me is when someone says they have a RAPTOR jungle or those others that you mentioned. A raptor is a patternless, but it's now being used as a very lose term for geckos with red eyes....That's just wwhat I've been seeing.

 

[ByRandom]

I also think that it should be "Snake Eyed APTOR"... But.. that's just me. :main_yes:

 

[okapi]

RERS = Red eyed reverse stripe.
I like patterned 'raptors' better than patternless 'raptors'

 

[yellermelon]

I like patternless better Especially the deeep orange ones.

 

[Ipsl]

I could be off here but isnt the "eclipse" gene for black eyes not red? Isn't the red eyes a trait of albinism?

Asw far as rareity I would think that true patternless APTOR would be more rare as its a specific recessive trait goal. Whereas RERs and the like are just "genetic leftovers" not saying they're not cool. just from purely pseudo-scientific approach. ;P

 

[Mel&Keith]

I could be off here but isnt the "eclipse" gene for black eyes not red? Isn't the red eyes a trait of albinism?

Some people are using the term Eclipse interchangeably for black or red-eyed geckos since "RAPTOR" excludes all patterns other than Patternless Stripe.

 

[tangerineman]

just looking at this,

..i thought it was obvious, but I am not talking abouyt a recessive trait 'patternless' being bred into the RAPTOR genetics, this is not a discussion about anything having to do with the HYPO gene ...

what i am referring to is the lack of spots through selective breeding , which is what the RAPTOR morph was meant to be...a greatly reduced spotted, brightly colored, red eyed or snake eyed, albino gecko.

From what I see it appears that spotted and dark RAPTORs are prevalent pretty much anywhere. To me it seems the direction this *could* go is lack of outcrossing to good stock which is characteristic of the traits which are trying to be bred, and maybe the urge to inbreed back to your own stock, (because of the expense of getting 'new blood')

-D

btw, thanks everyone for your responses..

 

[eric]

great topic!! could some one post pics of the patternless, rers, and abberant for us greenies..

 

[godzillizard]

The only pattern I haven't seen produced from the (R)APTOR complex/project would be the striped version. I have seen banded, jungle, reverse stripe, and MANY, MANY "incomplete" patternless stripe (reduced pattern) (R)aptors, but I've yet to see a perfect striped version of the "(R)APTOR".

A "patternless stripe" is the original (R)aptor look--carrot-head with a striped carrot tail

A RERS is an albino reverse stripe with red eyes

an aberrant is a gecko with slightly abnormal patterning--like if a band is broken, or uneven--I assume that jungles were originally created by breeding aberrants together?!?

 

[supperl]

Well I would say it that way... patternless stripe Eclispe Albino is the real Raptor and should be named as such. My female Raptor is realy a Raptor and my male is not realy a raptor.
This is my female:

And this is the male(I would say a RERS or Eclispe Tremper reverse Stripe)

To Jerome, as far as I understood it right, the nonalbino Eclipse gene would make black eyes. When these Eclispe eyed Geckos are Albinos, they would be red eyed. So pairing an Bell to a nonhet for anything Eclipse would bring me normals het for Radar.

And if that´s all right, than I would say name the Jungles Abbarants Bandeds as what they are Jungle, Abbarant, Banded- Eclipse Albino.
WOuld make everything easier and guarantees that if someone is buying a Raptor he is getting the Raptor and not a RERS like me^^

 

[eric]

Thanks Thorsten!!

 

[godzillizard]

And if that´s all right, than I would say name the Jungles Abbarants Bandeds as what they are Jungle, Abbarant, Banded- Eclipse Albino.
WOuld make everything easier and guarantees that if someone is buying a Raptor he is getting the Raptor and not a RERS like me

I completely agree Thorsten! It is nice when an apple is called an apple, but alot of breeders are more interested in giving names that sell more geckos, than giving accurate, easy to understand names for their creations...