Sleeping a lot outside of hide?

[ncbeast]

Ok, have a year old Leo that has started sleeping outside of his hide on the hot side. He sleeps almost all of the time and stays in the same place in the floor between the two hides on the hot side. Floor temp has been between 88-92. I read that it might be too hot in his hide so I moved the prob in the hide for 2 days and it did not get over 97. Then I turned the thermostate down and now the floor temp is 84-88 but nothing changed still sleeps all of the time right out in the open all of the time. He sleeps probably 90% of the time and does not get up and walk around very much at all anymore. About the only time he gets up is for feeding every other day and he still eats very well, 5-7 large crickets and hunts them down really good but after he is done he goes back to sleep again for two days until his next feeding. The only other thing we are doing is that we have a red cfl bulb going all of the time in the tank and we always open the blind in that room so the day light fills the room.

I am thinking since he still eats well, sheds well and poops well that maybe this is just the way he is and since we do not have a white light in the tank anymore he is comfortable sleeping outside of the hides. But since he is not going to the cold side at all maybe I should crank the heat up to 92-96 to see if he will go back and forth to regulate. I just do not want him too hot and cause any other issues.

Any advise please let me know.

Thanks

 

[Dog Shrink]

Hey there... remember my posts about Eros having a couple bad sheds.. well after talking in length to his breeder, reading some posts by Designer geckos on temps and talking to some of the more seasoned members here on the forum I found out that I was keeping him way too hot. I was keeping his temps at between 95-98 in his hot hide and he started having fragmented sheds. I listened to the pros and dropped him to betwen 87-91.5 max now and he is doing much better. I see him thermoregulate by going from one side of the hide to the other since he can get a degree of hot or cool by just moving in the hide (it's a large hide, you've seen it). The only time I use my blue moonlight bulb now is during his week of shed and I only put it over his humid hide to make it more "sauna" like. Since we've been doing this sheds are now perfect again, appetite has increased, he's more active and alert, and he looks all around happier. Keep in mind some like it hotter, some like it cooler. Yours may be a cooler kinda guy. Experiment with your temps the next couple days. go for a low range of like 86-89, a mid range of 87-97 and a high range of 88-92 and see how it affects him. I know that a degree or 2 isn't much but I see how Eros acts when it's 90 versus 92 and to them it seems to make a difference. He is most comfortable at 89-90.

If you don't see any change in his behavior by lowering the temps then maybe he is just THAT comfortable in the new digs

 

[ncbeast]

Hey there... remember my posts about Eros having a couple bad sheds.. well after talking in length to his breeder, reading some posts by Designer geckos on temps and talking to some of the more seasoned members here on the forum I found out that I was keeping him way too hot. I was keeping his temps at between 95-98 in his hot hide and he started having fragmented sheds. I listened to the pros and dropped him to betwen 87-91.5 max now and he is doing much better. I see him thermoregulate by going from one side of the hide to the other since he can get a degree of hot or cool by just moving in the hide (it's a large hide, you've seen it). The only time I use my blue moonlight bulb now is during his week of shed and I only put it over his humid hide to make it more "sauna" like. Since we've been doing this sheds are now perfect again, appetite has increased, he's more active and alert, and he looks all around happier. Keep in mind some like it hotter, some like it cooler. Yours may be a cooler kinda guy. Experiment with your temps the next couple days. go for a low range of like 86-89, a mid range of 87-97 and a high range of 88-92 and see how it affects him. I know that a degree or 2 isn't much but I see how Eros acts when it's 90 versus 92 and to them it seems to make a difference. He is most comfortable at 89-90.

If you don't see any change in his behavior by lowering the temps then maybe he is just THAT comfortable in the new digs

Hey Kellie, I do remember you talking about the bad sheds and how you lowered the temp and all was good. That is why I dropped the temp down to 84-88 from 88-92 to see if he would move around more and/or go in his hot hide. I did this last night and he still stayed sleeping in the same hot spot between the hides. I checked on him several times last night and this morning and still the same.

The thing that bothers me is that he stays on the hot side even at the 88-92 so I just want to make sure he is warm enough. He has only been in the cool hide maybe twice since he has been in the new digs.

I will keep it at the 88-92 today and if no change go up to the 92-96 and see if he will thermoregulate.

Is it bad if they stay on the hot side all of the time? I was thinking he is sleeping more due to winter and the ambient temp but his eating has not slowed at all.

 

[Dog Shrink]

I don't honestly recommend taking it that hot. Eros would NEVER go to his cold side even if his hot hide hit 101. And yeah if their temps are consistantly too hight... well think beef jerkey was how it was put to me. If you had it that low and he was still staying outside the hide I woud lean more towards he's just feeling really comfy and safe in the new digs.

 

[ncbeast]

Yeah, I really do not want to get it that hot either. I think I will just move it back to 88-92 and just see how it goes. Maybe it is just a phase.

Here is a copy of some pictures. The one is where he lays all of the time now except when eating, between the two hides on the hot side. The other was him chasing a cricket up the back wall the other night....he did get it too!!!

 

[Dog Shrink]

hehehe wall crickets are nommy BTW Did you use a light or a flash on the wall shot? He seems really bright there. He seems to have good color on the other pic. Not excessively bright which would indicate higher temps to me (knowing what I know about your set up ) if anything his color looks to me as if it would be a cooler temp color. Eros def. has a hot color and a cool color. Hot you actually see his yellow quite clearly and cool he looks camouflaged in shades of tans whites and blacks, barely any yellow shows thru.

 

[ncbeast]

hehehe wall crickets are nommy BTW Did you use a light or a flash on the wall shot? He seems really bright there. He seems to have good color on the other pic. Not excessively bright which would indicate higher temps to me (knowing what I know about your set up ) if anything his color looks to me as if it would be a cooler temp color. Eros def. has a hot color and a cool color. Hot you actually see his yellow quite clearly and cool he looks camouflaged in shades of tans whites and blacks, barely any yellow shows thru.

Yes, there is probably a flash on both, taken with my Blackberry Storm but the one where he is on the wall is right up on the glass and the other one is taken from the top through the screen. So his color is actually about in the middle of both of these.

Got home and he is still in the same place and the temp was 86. Turned the stat back up to where is will be 88-92 again and just will keep an eye on him.

 

[roger]

Ok, have a year old Leo that has started sleeping outside of his hide on the hot side. He sleeps almost all of the time and stays in the same place in the floor between the two hides on the hot side. Floor temp has been between 88-92. I read that it might be too hot in his hide so I moved the prob in the hide for 2 days and it did not get over 97. Then I turned the thermostate down and now the floor temp is 84-88 but nothing changed still sleeps all of the time right out in the open all of the time. He sleeps probably 90% of the time and does not get up and walk around very much at all anymore. About the only time he gets up is for feeding every other day and he still eats very well, 5-7 large crickets and hunts them down really good but after he is done he goes back to sleep again for two days until his next feeding. The only other thing we are doing is that we have a red cfl bulb going all of the time in the tank and we always open the blind in that room so the day light fills the room.

I am thinking since he still eats well, sheds well and poops well that maybe this is just the way he is and since we do not have a white light in the tank anymore he is comfortable sleeping outside of the hides. But since he is not going to the cold side at all maybe I should crank the heat up to 92-96 to see if he will go back and forth to regulate. I just do not want him too hot and cause any other issues.

Any advise please let me know.

Thanks

Although all leos are differnent ,all leos will thermo regulate.As long as u give him the a wide variety of temps why not let the animal choose whats best for him instead of u choosing. As long as u have a heat varience of between 88-95 the leo will pick what temps suits him.If 95 is too warm for the animal he will physically chhose whats best for him whether thats 91,93,95 deg.PPl get too hung up on having the precise temps and they fuss to make sure its exact,thats why leos are great u can give them a wide margin and they take whats good for them.If he is eating and pooing than leave his temps alone.Do not adjust anyhting.Thats the beauti of leos they can pick whats best for them.What would happen if u only gave him the choice of a heat gradient of 88-90 ? What would u do if he would thrive better at say 96? At least my way u are giving him the choice of a temp 88-95

 

[gothra]

Although all leos are differnent ,all leos will thermo regulate.As long as u give him the a wide variety of temps why not let the animal choose whats best for him instead of u choosing. As long as u have a heat varience of between 88-95 the leo will pick what temps suits him.If 95 is too warm for the animal he will physically chhose whats best for him whether thats 91,93,95 deg.PPl get too hung up on having the precise temps and they fuss to make sure its exact,thats why leos are great u can give them a wide margin and they take whats good for them.If he is eating and pooing than leave his temps alone.Do not adjust anyhting.Thats the beauti of leos they can pick whats best for them.What would happen if u only gave him the choice of a heat gradient of 88-90 ? What would u do if he would thrive better at say 96? At least my way u are giving him the choice of a temp 88-95

Exactly!! I'm so glad you wrote it out (again). :main_thumbsup:

 

[Dog Shrink]

The temperatures Beast and I were discussing were the high end range, not the overall range just to clear that up. Also you say all will thermoregulate but that's a pretty broad statement. If they all did you wouldn't have herps getting burnt on heating elements imo. Like I mentioned I have NEVER seen Eros hang out anywhre else in his cage except for his hot hide and his humid tupperware hide when he's close to a shed. I have seen his tank hot... hot enough to make ME want to move somewhere cooler and he still will not sit somewhere else despite having several other places he feel comfortable.

 

[roger]

The temperatures Beast and I were discussing were the high end range, not the overall range just to clear that up. Also you say all will thermoregulate but that's a pretty broad statement. If they all did you wouldn't have herps getting burnt on heating elements imo. Like I mentioned I have NEVER seen Eros hang out anywhre else in his cage except for his hot hide and his humid tupperware hide when he's close to a shed. I have seen his tank hot... hot enough to make ME want to move somewhere cooler and he still will not sit somewhere else despite having several other places he feel comfortable.

your basing some of your info on your leo.Someone elses leo might feel more comfortable at 97.ive never had a leo or heard of a leo get burnt at 95 or even 98 deg if thats what your suggesting .?Ive heard of snakes getting burnt but not leos. saying leos thermo regulat is not a broad statement its fact.If your leo wont move from a certain spot that is where he is comfortable.Leo husbandry is not a exact science.Imo a leo will find exactly where his comfort zone is in regards to warmth.if it is way too warm for him he will move.its that simple and if he doesnt move thats where he is comfortable at.What u are doing dog shrink is limiting your leo to a certain warmth and for your leo thats great but for other ppl its inportant for them to offer their leo a gradient of 88-98 on the warm end to a room temperature on the cool end.We need to give our leos some credit and let them decide what their warmth needs are instead of us dictating what their warm end should be.

 

[Dog Shrink]

your basing some of your info on your leo.Exactly why I said SOME LIKE IT HOTTER SOME LIKE IT COOLER but was using mine as a guideline reference that keeping them cooler doesn't hurt them and some actually appreciate it more. Someone elses leo might feel more comfortable at 97.

ive never had a leo or heard of a leo get burnt at 95 or even 98 deg if thats what your suggesting .? That was NOT what I was suggesting. I was meerly stating tha tnot all reptiles will thermoregulate uding the instance of those that get burnt on HEAT ROCKS as a reference to point to the fact they ALL DON'T move just because they're suppose to.
Ive heard of snakes getting burnt but not leos. saying leos thermo regulat is not a broad statement its fact.If your leo wont move from a certain spot that is where he is comfortable.Leo husbandry is not a exact science.Imo a leo will find exactly where his comfort zone is in regards to warmth.if it is way too warm for him he will move. I have to disagree with this. My leo's uth brought his hot hide temps one day to damn near 105 degrees and he didn't BUDGE out of that hide.

its that simple and if he doesnt move thats where he is comfortable at.What u are doing dog shrink is limiting your leo to a certain warmth and for your leo thats great but for other ppl its inportant for them to offer their leo a gradient of 88-98 on the warm end to a room temperature on the cool end. Just how do you propose getting a 10 dgree temperature gradient on a hot side of your tank with just using a uth? Is that even possible? To me that makes no logical sense let alone trying to figure out how to actually do it. Did you happen to read the thread that Desginer Geckos posted about temperature ranges? They did experiements on it and tested their theory and found 98 to be way to high for most leos to comfortably and heaalthfully tolerate. My leo did horribly at temps over 95. He got dried out, decreased appetite, and had horrid sheds, got lethargic, it wasn't good. What I'M doing is limiting my leos hot range to an area that after reading much about temps and testing some theories for myself is much safer and healthier for him.
We need to give our leos some credit and let them decide what their warmth needs are instead of us dictating what their warm end should be.
That's all fine and great until you get that leo that doesn't like to move regardless of what temps/gradient you provide. I blame a lot of my leos lack of desire to move to being solely tub raised from a hatchling. Others may have different experiences with their tub raised leos going into natural settings but mine is different. Despite there being other areas he could go to cool, he doesn't, others may experience teh same thing. Yes this is a portrait of what works for MY leo, and I thought that was the point to a forum discussion. To throw out ideas of what works for YOU and letting the OP see there ARE other ways to do it, there isn't one cut and dry way that works for everyone and every leo like we have both said. Like I stated before saying ALL leos will thermoregulate to another part of their tank is not a fair statement as mine doesn't do it, so saying ALL do it is simply not true.

Beast, all I can suggest is like I said before, play around with your temps a bit, read a lot of the other threads regarding temps and look at the polls of how others are keeping their temps. Get all the info you can, see how it affects your leo, see what he does and find YOUR leo's optimum range.

 

[roger]

Dog shrink- You question how u can get a 10 deg gradient on the warm end? U got yours up to 105 didint u ?And it is possible to give your leo a variance of 10 degrees because i used to do the exact thing when i used to use a heat pad.I gave them an option of heat .You seem to not accept the fact that its better to give the leos the choice of temps.When I guess the bottom line is we agree on some things u said and I disagree with others.What works for your leos is great and what Im doing with my leos is working for me.Each leo WILL thermoregulate. Over 25 yrs Ive had apprx 200 leos ,hatchlings etc at 95 and every single leo has thrived beautifully and eat great.Id like to think that im doing something right.What i have been consistent on saying is keep the temps between 88-95 deg

 

[Dog Shrink]

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[roger]

Actually you said 88-98 degrees but that's just nit picking But alas I do have to disagree with every leo will thermoregulate as mine doesn't... he goes from one side of his hide to the other side of his hide which is barely a 2 degree difference but he will not go to another hide for a greater cooler temp to truly thermoregulate. Maybe my leo is just odd.

or maybe u dont notice him thermoregulating.U never see your leo at the cooler end ??i rarely see my leos drink or copulate but I know they do.

 

[Dog Shrink]

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[roger]

Nope. The only time I see him on the cooler end is right after I had him out and he's goin back in his tank (and at that it's just a cruise around the platform and rock formations until he makes his way back to his regular hide), if I'm misting his tank or he just ate and is full. Aside of that I never see him go there.

For u to be that sure u must be watching him 24/7.So while your sleeping your sure your leo is not thermoregulating??.So if your just going by visuals are u going to tell me your leo doesnt drink or lick calcium since we rarely see them do both but we know they do it.? Just because you dont witness your leo thermoregulating doesnt mean its not happening but im sure you'll stick to your claim

 

[Dog Shrink]

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[roger]

Hey there... remember my posts about Eros having a couple bad sheds.. well after talking in length to his breeder, reading some posts by Designer geckos on temps and talking to some of the more seasoned members here on the forum I found out that I was keeping him way too hot. I was keeping his temps at between 95-98 in his hot hide and he started having fragmented sheds. I listened to the pros and dropped him to betwen 87-91.5 max now and he is doing much better. I see him thermoregulate by going from one side of the hide to the other since he can get a degree of hot or cool by just moving in the hide (it's a large hide, you've seen it). The only time I use my blue moonlight bulb now is during his week of shed and I only put it over his humid hide to make it more "sauna" like. Since we've been doing this sheds are now perfect again, appetite has increased, he's more active and alert, and he looks all around happier. Keep in mind some like it hotter, some like it cooler. Yours may be a cooler kinda guy. Experiment with your temps the next couple days. go for a low range of like 86-89, a mid range of 87-97 and a high range of 88-92 and see how it affects him. I know that a degree or 2 isn't much but I see how Eros acts when it's 90 versus 92 and to them it seems to make a difference. He is most comfortable at 89-90.

If you don't see any change in his behavior by lowering the temps then maybe he is just THAT comfortable in the new digs

You just finished telling me that your leo doesnt thermoregulate ,but in the above post u claim he regulates in his rather large hide where he moves from one side to the other where it is one or two degrees cooler.That Dog shrink is called thermoregulating:main_huh:

 

[Dog Shrink]

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