The story of the 6-inch female leo begins...

[Dancing Gecko]

Someone recently gave me a female leo that was being kept in an enclosure full of males. She's a little over 6 inches long, although I have no idea of her age or her weight (I have no scale...I know I need to get one, but I wasn't planning on breeding until summer)

My question is, if she is gravid, will she survive egg-laying? She's the picture of health other than her size. She's bright-eyed and active, and full of spunk as well. I've never had a leo bite me as soon as I opened the box before, lol.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Dog Shrink]

You really do need a scale for this to be answered properly. You can find one at walm art for under $20 I believe. From what I understand of females ready to breed is that they should be at least 30-ish grams minimum... hopefully more experienced keepers will chime in as I don't breed but that is just what I have read on other threads on the forum. Maybe checking in the breeding forum will give you a better idea.

 

[roger]

You really do need a scale for this to be answered properly. You can find one at walm art for under $20 I believe. From what I understand of females ready to breed is that they should be at least 30-ish grams minimum... hopefully more experienced keepers will chime in as I don't breed but that is just what I have read on other threads on the forum. Maybe checking in the breeding forum will give you a better idea.

Dog shrink-you are definately wrong on your breeding weight.The minimum a female leo should be is no less than 50grs possibly 45 grs.I'm not sure what post u read but they are definately wrong.They lose a ton of weight due to the breeding so u need to pack on the food pre breeding.Most breeders myself included use the 50 gr weight

 

[Khrysty]

Dog shrink-you are definately wrong on your breeding weight.The minimum a female leo should be is no less than 50grs possibly 45 grs.I'm not sure what post u read but they are definately wrong.They lose a ton of weight due to the breeding so u need to pack on the food pre breeding.Most breeders myself included use the 50 gr weight

A female can survive egg laying at 30+ grams. HOWEVER, most breeders prefer they weigh 50+ grams for the reasons you mentioned above. So, in essence, you were both right.

To the OP, I have full grown adult females at 6 inches that weigh over 60 grams. I also have juvy females at that length that weigh 25-30ish grams. Survival is based on weight, more than size. If you can get a scale and get her weighed we might be able to help you better.

 

[Dog Shrink]

Thank you both for the clarification on breeding weight. I thought I had seen a debate on here about proper breeding weight. I knew I wasn't going crazy.

 

[roger]

A female can survive egg laying at 30+ grams. HOWEVER, most breeders prefer they weigh 50+ grams for the reasons you mentioned above. So, in essence, you were both right.

To the OP, I have full grown adult females at 6 inches that weigh over 60 grams. I also have juvy females at that length that weigh 25-30ish grams. Survival is based on weight, more than size. If you can get a scale and get her weighed we might be able to help you better.

Sure a leo can survive laying at 30 grs.Those circumstances happen by mistake and are rare but I dont know of one breeder who intentionally breeds a leo at 30 grs.

 

[Khrysty]

Sure a leo can survive laying at 30 grs.Those circumstances happen by mistake and are rare but I dont know of one breeder who intentionally breeds a leo at 30 grs.

The OP was asking about survival. The leopard in question has already been accidentally bred. I'm not encouraging people to go out and try it. No reputable breeder worth his salt would endanger the life of their animal like that. I'm simply saying that if the leo is that thin, it does have a chance at survival. Obviously, chances of survival go up with the more weight the animal has, but that wasn't the question asked.

 

[roger]

The OP was asking about survival. The leopard in question has already been accidentally bred. I'm not encouraging people to go out and try it. No reputable breeder worth his salt would endanger the life of their animal like that. I'm simply saying that if the leo is that thin, it does have a chance at survival. Obviously, chances of survival go up with the more weight the animal has, but that wasn't the question asked.

I agree with u Khristy.

 

[Reborn]

If it makes the OP feel better, i bought 2 females off craigslist and they both were gravid and both small(one just under 6 inchs and a year old and the other just over 7 inchs and a year and a half). Both werent in tip top conditions in fact the 6 inch was only32 grams(the 7 was 37g) i worried sick about them since they werent eating when i got them and i knew there lay date was coming fast. The 7 inch laid one egg which was good and i have the baby today. The 6 in laid 2 duds. I didnt see any problems with them pushing them out nor any issues with MBD or anything. They did, it seemed, ate there own weight in calcuim! I think your little girl will pass them just fine. Giving her a warm soak helps too;D Mine enjoyed it(tho they had stuck on shed bad so it was necessary). Mine now are at 60 and 73 grams!Good luck! Keep us updated on how it goes.

 

[Daedric1]

I'm simply saying that if the leo is that thin, it does have a chance at survival. Obviously, chances of survival go up with the more weight the animal has, but that wasn't the question asked.

I don't think the question is in regards to how thin the animal is. As the OP stated, "She's the picture of health other than her size," which is 6 inches long. The OP doesn't know the age either, so it may well be that this leo is just young but a good weight for it's age.

In a young female that is gravid, it is more likely that the female will become eggbound and unable to lay it's eggs because its body is not developed enough yet, causing the leo more problems. If the eggs are laid, it's also possible for the female to get injured in the laying process. The leo can indeed survive if gravid, but it has a greater risk of dying than a fully developed leo.

In other words, it's possible for a 13 year old girl to get pregnant and have a baby, but the process of giving birth puts the girl at more risk because her body is not done growing yet, making it much harder to pass a baby.

 

[roger]

I don't think the question is in regards to how thin the animal is. As the OP stated, "She's the picture of health other than her size," which is 6 inches long. The OP doesn't know the age either, so it may well be that this leo is just young but a good weight for it's age.

In a young female that is gravid, it is more likely that the female will become eggbound and unable to lay it's eggs because its body is not developed enough yet, causing the leo more problems. If the eggs are laid, it's also possible for the female to get injured in the laying process. The leo can indeed survive if gravid, but it has a greater risk of dying than a fully developed leo.

In other words, it's possible for a 13 year old girl to get pregnant and have a baby, but the process of giving birth puts the girl at more risk because her body is not done growing yet, making it much harder to pass a baby.

Very well put.I would also like to say if a breeder is intentionally breeding leos at 30 grs they have no respect for the animal.I do understand that ppl dont realize they have bought or received a gravid leo.they will have to make the best of the situation and hopefully the 30 gr leo comes out of it ok

 

[Dancing Gecko]

Ok! I managed to get hold of a scale and weighed her. She is about 27 grams. However, her appetite is excellent and I've been feeding her mostly waxworms (dusted with calcium of course) to help her pack on the grams. She isn't showing any signs of gravidity yet, but I'm sure she was bred since she was being kept with males. Hopefully she'll put on weight.

I really, really hope she makes it. The people who had her were doing everything else right...they just didn't know that she was a girl. Which kind of makes me wonder how they kept all those males from fighting...oh well. Thanks to all you guys for your help! I'll keep you updated on her condition.

 

[Imperial Geckos]

Ok! I managed to get hold of a scale and weighed her. She is about 27 grams. However, her appetite is excellent and I've been feeding her mostly waxworms (dusted with calcium of course) to help her pack on the grams. She isn't showing any signs of gravidity yet, but I'm sure she was bred since she was being kept with males. Hopefully she'll put on weight.

I really, really hope she makes it. The people who had her were doing everything else right...they just didn't know that she was a girl. Which kind of makes me wonder how they kept all those males from fighting...oh well. Thanks to all you guys for your help! I'll keep you updated on her condition.

If she is not ovualting she cant be gravid... so is she ovulating? :main_rolleyes:

 

[Dancing Gecko]

Yes, she appears to be ovulating. Is it possible for a leo to reabsorb her eggs, like mammals can reabsorb a fetus? If so, is there any safe way to induce this? I really, really, don't want her to become egg-bound. She's just so tiny...

 

[roger]

Yes, she appears to be ovulating. Is it possible for a leo to reabsorb her eggs, like mammals can reabsorb a fetus? If so, is there any safe way to induce this? I really, really, don't want her to become egg-bound. She's just so tiny...

If she develops eggs, she will probably lay infertile eggs.I'm not sure if a tiny leo can reabsorb the eggs.If she does lay them right b4 u can maybe give her some warm baths.