Triple albino?

[Isis]

I don't know whether this was discussed earlier, but I am curious did anyone trie to make a triple albino (Rainwater+Bell+Tremper)? I am wondering how such a gecno would look like All these treats concern different genes so I think this one would be cool looking

 

[Mel&Keith]

If one has been produced, I don't believe there are any photos of it. The general consensus in the Leopard Gecko community is that the 3 Albino strains are not compatible.

 

[mark97r1]

Also if the 3 arnt compatable, doesnt this imply they occupy the same locus?
Meaning they could only ever be double hets??

Mark

 

[Nigel4less]

The thing is that it is possible to produce Homozygous Animals for two strains in one animal. But the reason its frowned upon because the it would be impossible to tell them apart.

 

[Isis]

Oh I don't think so. Why do you make e.g. blizzard patternless? they are very similar but you still make geckos with both mutations together... this is the same situation.

Are they really mutations of the same gene? I don't think so.

The 4 generation breeding project should produce such a gecko:
E.g. Bell x Tremper -> Double het
Double het x double het -> double albino
double albino x rainwater-> triple het
triple het x triple het -> triple albino

I personally think it would be something new. You don't really know how the genes would influence one another and how would they affect eyes and skin.

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

The problem with producing a double or triple homozygous Tremper/Bell/Rainwater morph would be that you would not be able to tell if it was truly a double or triple albino without genetic testing.

You would have to genetically test all three of the albino strains separately, and then all the combination hets they produce, and then all the offspring that came from those hets. It would cost A LOT of money!

 

[Ipsl]

Also, to make one from scratch is a REAL long shot. trip hets make it damn near impossable to produce a trip albino. Trust me or if you'd like I can show you what it would look like genetically.

 

[Isis]

I am purely into theory now, I don;t know how would it look like in life
You mean the problem is with the part double het x double het?
Yes, I admit it is the hard part in all of this

 

[Ipsl]

Well heres the possibilities right here:
2% tt bb rr trip albino
3% tt bb Ar bell tremp het RW
3% tt Ab rr tremp RW het bell
6% tt Ab Ar tremp double het
3% At bb rr bell RW het tremp
6% At bb Ar bell double het
6% At Ab rr RW double het
12% At Ab Ar trip het
2% tt bb AA bell tremp
3% tt Ab AA tremp het bell
3% At bb AA bell het tremp
6% At Ab AA double het bell/ tremp
2% tt AA rr tremper RW
3% tt AA Ar tremper het RW
3% At AA rr RW het Tremp
6% At AA Ar double het tremp/ RW
1% tt AA AA tremp
3% At AA AA het tremp
2% AA bb rr RW Bell
3% AA bb Ar Bell het RW
3% AA Ab rr RW het Bel
6% AA Ab Ar double het bell RW
1% AA bb AA bell
3% AA Ab AA het Bell
2% AA AA rr RW
3% AA AA Ar het RW
2% AA AA AA Normal

thats the stats. Its not hard I made a program

 

[Isis]

You can exclude normals (obviously) and non-bell albino if your lucky

My reasoning is that there would be some hallmarks of the triple albino to distinguish from others :J
Bu of course you're right that it could be completely undistinguishable.

 

[Ipsl]

Thats ALL the outcomes of a trip het x trip het.

As you can see theres about a 1 in 50 shot of getting a trip albino. Just as much as getting a normal

 

[nevinm]

no one had produced a true patternless blizz yet, or atleast proved one out yet. and a patternless blizz would probably look like a combo of both genes, and would be able to tell them apart. the bell, and tremper lines were crossed, and the double albinos looked just like both albino strains, and they couldnt be told apart. i always tell people that if you crossed the strains, the babies would probably be worthles. few people would want to pay money for these animals. the albinos are all beautiful on their own. there really is no need to cross them. its just not worth it

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

You can exclude normals (obviously) and non-bell albino if your lucky

Well, you can't exclude all the normals, because any pairing between any two of the albino strains would produce all normals (double hets).

no one had produced a true patternless blizz yet, or at least proved one out yet. and a patternless blizz would probably look like a combo of both genes, and would be able to tell them apart.

Actually, there have been several proven patternless blizzards (Banana Blizzards). The propblem is that some not-so-etchical breeders have passed off really yellow blizzards as Bananas, but they have no patty genes.

 

[Nigel4less]

If I remember correctly Prehistoric Pets(Blizzard creators) created a group of possible Double Homo Banana Blizzards but Double het x double het is a 1/16 chance of producing a True Banana Blizzard

 

[nevinm]

maria, thats what ive been told, but when i go to find out who it is, its like a wild goose chase..."no that wasnt me, that was...", "yeah i made one, but i sold it befor i could prove it out, go talk to...."oh sorry, i just sold that one to..." "yeah i have it, im trying to prove it right now but it doesnt want to breed". know what i mean? and nigel, they are another that claimed it, but never proved it.

 

[phalanx]

I always thought that the 3 different albino strains stopped the production of black pigmentation at a certain (but different) time in the evolution of the em in the egg.

I get to the following question:
Suppose albino strain one stops black pigmentation in an earlier stadium than strain 2 and 3. -> is the optical result of a double / triple albino the optical result of albino strain 1?

or does that theory doesn't make sense?

 

[Rejoice in the Lord]

Sounds like it would be a long project! Something I'll never do, but it's intriguing to think about.

You start with three leos; a RW, a Tremp, and a Bell.

First year
Cross the RW and Bell; and cross the Tremp and Bell.
babies all normal double het for RW and Bell; babies all normal double het for tremp and bell

Second year
Cross the double hets with siblings to try to get RW Bells and Tremp Bells.
1/4 would appear to be normal, and be hets like their parents
1/2 would show an albino trait, and be het for another
1/4 would be double albinos; either RW Bells, or Tremp Bells

Have fun distinguishing the last two groups. I think that the only way to know who was what would be to keep careful records, and take two years test breeding.

third year - proving out albinos by breeding back to one of the original albino grandparents

fourth year - proving out albinos by breeding back to the other of the original albino grandparents

Now you know which leos are expressing two albino strains. Keep only these, and find good homes for all the others.

fifth year breed a RW Bell with a Tremp Bell.
Babies will all be Bell het Rw het Tremp

sixth year --breed fifth year's babies together. Somewhere among them, you should have a triple albino; but you may not know which ones they are until after another two years of test breeding.

All the babies should be Bells.
1/4 will also be het RW, het Tremp (like their parents)
1/4 will also be RW het Tremp
1/4 will also be Tremp het RW
and 1/4 will be . . . TRIPLE ALBINO . . . if it's possible to make one.

Seventh year
proving albinos by breeding them with RW

Eighth year
proving albinos by breeding them with Tremp

Ninth year
start your own triple albino line!

ooooops That looks like an awful lot of inbreeding!

 

[paulnj]

Nevin, I am in the process of proving the father of what I think is a mack patt/blizz pair I recently hatched from my SSRWBB project. That'll be some indication as to if my thinking is correct.