Enough D3?

[sleepzilla]

If I'm using a gutload for the mealworms that has some D3 supplement in it, do i still need to use a Ca+D3 dust on the mealworms? I'll be using Fluker's High Calcium Cricket Diet to gutload (has D3 supplement as an ingredient), and herptivite to dust. I'll also have a plain Calcium dish in with my geckos. Should I get a Ca+D3 supp to mix with the herptivite even tho the gutload has some D3?

 

[Ga_herps]

I would not worry about getting the extra ca+d3 mix on top of what you are already doing. I keep a dish of cal. in the tubs at all times, and vitamin supp. is given only a couple of times a month. If you have the dish in there then no you would not still need to dust your mealies.

 

[Western Gecko]

I wouldn't rely on the gutloaded mealworms to supply your geckos with the D3 that your leopard gecko requires. I seriously doubt that a mealworm will consume and retain the vitamin for eventual transfer to the gecko. How can you be sure the worm is even consuming the D3 in addition to the grain based substrate you keep the worms in? It sounds like the product is meant for crickets where gutloading is a very valid and proven process. I doubt the gut volume of a mealworm is sufficient. I could be wrong on this but why take the chance.

I've been having very good success with raising ALL my hatchlings on feeders dusted with 100% Calcium Plus. I don't use any other supplement with my non-breeding geckos.

You have brought up a very valid question though... :main_robin:

 

[Gregg M]

I wouldn't rely on the gutloaded mealworms to supply your geckos with the D3 that your leopard gecko requires.

So, what would you say a gecko requires as far as D3 goes???

I seriously doubt that a mealworm will consume and retain the vitamin for eventual transfer to the gecko. How can you be sure the worm is even consuming the D3 in addition to the grain based substrate you keep the worms in? It sounds like the product is meant for crickets where gutloading is a very valid and proven process. I doubt the gut volume of a mealworm is sufficient. I could be wrong on this but why take the chance.

You seem to have a bunch of doubts with nothing substantial to back it up... Gut loading is a very valid and proven process with meal worms as well... What exactly makes you believe that meal worms are incapable of comsumption and retention of vitamins and minerals???

Did you know that leos can consume too much D3??? It is a fat soluable vitamin that does not get used as often or expelled from the body nearly as fast as water soluable vitamins... This means that D3 stays in the system unused for long periods of time and if you keep introducing a vitamin into the body that is not being used or being expelled from the body quickly, it can cause a few problems that can lead to eventual death...

There is no reason to intruduce D3 into a leos diet more than a couple of times a month... In my opinion, the same can be said for other vitamin supplements...

I've been having very good success with raising ALL my hatchlings on feeders dusted with 100% Calcium Plus. I don't use any other supplement with my non-breeding geckos.

You have brought up a very valid question though... :main_robin:

I didnt mean to pick your post apart but some things needed to be addressed...

 

[Western Gecko]

Gregg,

I'm not going to get into the D3 debate with you again. We agree to disagree.

We both know that geckos, as well as all other animals, need D3 to process calcium. It's a matter of how much and how often.

I consider D3 uptake from undusted mealworms an unorthodox method of administering the vitamin and until someone can prove to me that the mealworm eats and retains the vitamin I'll "doubt" it and continue to dust my mealworms with D3 every feeding. I've been dusting every feeder with Calcium Plus (with D3) since October '08 and no one has croaked yet.

In an effort to side track the thread, how are your hypo snows coming along?
This is the best I've been able to come up with...

I can't call it a cremesicle yet. All the offspring from this boy are looking more hypo snow than cremesicle...

Later,

 

[ReptilesForTheWin]

Ok well tell me how geckos get calcium in the wild? They dont have a dish next to them when they are born do they?

 

[Western Gecko]

Ok well tell me how geckos get calcium in the wild? They dont have a dish next to them when they are born do they?

I don't know...

I've never observed a leopard gecko in the wild. Have you?

I would imagine the sun plays a big part...

 

[Western Gecko]

I don't know...

I've never observed a leopard gecko in the wild. Have you?

I would imagine the sun plays a big part...

Ooops by bad, D3 from the sun, calcium from the food...

 

[Gregg M]

I would imagine the sun plays a big part...

100% correct... All wild animals get their D3 from the sun... Even nocturnal ones...

I am not saying that you should not add D3 supplements to their diet... I am saying that it is not needed every feeding and there is proof it can be dangerous to do so...

Now for the creamsicles... The project is going well and I will have some really orange creamsicles for Daytona... They are coming along nicely... I will post hatchling pics soon... Your creamsicle project looks like it is moving in a good direction... You should get in touch with JMG... They will have something to boost the project foward... Thats where I got my original snows for my creamsicle projects...

 

[Gregg M]

Also too much vitamin D3 intake can interupt metabolism of fats... I have a funny feeling that D3 can be the cause of many fatty liver issues in reptiles... Just something to look into... All of the info I provide is easily researched... Also vitamin D3 is closer related to a hormone than it is to a vitamin...

 

[Western Gecko]

Now for the creamsicles... The project is going well and I will have some really orange creamsicles for Daytona... They are coming along nicely... I will post hatchling pics soon... Your creamsicle project looks like it is moving in a good direction... You should get in touch with JMG... They will have something to boost the project foward... Thats where I got my original snows for my creamsicle projects...

Yah, I check the jmg available page on a regular basis but with the new USF&W rules and fees it's a real pain in the a$$ to get geckos across the border. I need to be very selective about what I purchase.

I'm looking forward to seeing some of your cremesicles! I'll keep an eye out...:main_robin: