Hidden Hets - This year's big lesson.

[kkigs]

As I'm beginning to break up breeding groups for the off season, and the eggs are almost all hatched, I've been thinking about this, my first year seriously working with leopard geckos. Since I "left" the hobby back in 2004, an amazing amount of genetic discovery has taken place, with more morphs available, especially combo morphs, than I ever imagined back then. That said, it seems that there are schools of thought in the industry these days. Sell bigger, brighter and for more, without seemingly worrying about what's under the hood, and on the other side, the meticulous breeders who are really concerned about weeding out the unknown and working towards pure morphs.

This past year I bought several big males, two super giants, one that was supposed to be but turned out not to be, and all theoretically not het for Tremper albino. The breeder I bought the false super giant from gave me a 100% guarantee that he was not het, but I test bred him to three of my Tremper albino females anyway. The second hatchling was a bright, shiny albino. As was the fifth, and a couple more later on just for good measure. One of the super giants, my beloved Bold Mack Snow, Vader, was sold to me as 25% het albino. With luck on my side, 19 out of 19 eggs hatched from three different females, two albinos and a RAPTOR, with not an albino in the bunch! However, an unexpected surprise occurred, as several geckos popped out with nice clean reverse stripes. Closer inspection confirmed the suspicion... yep, het for Eclipse! That was not what I was after, but oh well, better than het for albino. I still have two more to prove, including my biggest SG male, and Elvis, my Giant Bold Stripe. To top off the summer of surprises, a Blood Hypo threw some lovely albino babies after being bred to a sunglow. Although not completely a bad thing, still not what I was looking for, and I certainly wasn't told that gecko was het for anything, because the dealer wouldn't have known.

After all that rambling, I'm curious what your experience is... do you test breed? Do you trust what the dealers/breeders tell you? Have you had similar experiences? What's been your big surprise/learning curve this year?

Thanks for reading!

 

[pmkent1]

I bought a breeder female this year that unexpectedly tured out to be het eclipse also. Popped out a nice looking black hole first thing this season. Happy surprise though.

I think my best lesson learned was the how varied the production rate is between females. Some with one or 2 viable eggs and some with A LOT more than expected

 

[acpart]

For the most part, my breeders have been what I expected although there have been a few times where statistics haven't worked out. I've had 2 surprises, both pleasant, in the past few years:
--a banded tremper who must have some stripe in his history because a high percentage of offspring from stripes are also striped
--a nice tangerine gecko of unkown origin who turned out to be het for tremper albino

Aliza

 

[justindh1]

I would believe that most super giants and giants are het for tremper. If you do find a pure one it should cost you a pretty penny. I have never had any surprises pop out from any pairing so I feel lucky. Most of my geckos are known hets or homo animals thought.

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

Over the years I have prided myself on keeping my recessive trait geckos pure, even when people gave me a bunch of crap about 'old-school' morphs. I learned a very painful lesson in trust from a large-scale breeder who guaranteed the pure genetics of a female I purchased to outcross my line. Now, after 14 years of careful selective breeding, a pure GGG line is corrupt. Quite frankly I don't know who to trust anymore. It goes deeper than that, because I believe the vast majority of leopard geckos out there today have hidden genetic traits from indiscriminate morph-making... whether we are aware of it or not. This is why I am a H-U-G-E proponent of full disclosure of everything you know about any gecko's lineage. At least people could make informed decisions when chosing geckos for their projects and not have 14 years of work disintegrate.

 

[bluevapor]

I had a snow female that turned out to be het. Bell and het. eclipse

 

[kkigs]

Thanks for the feedback. Marcia, I had hoped you would participate in this, because I know how you go about things and have years of experience in careful, selective breeding. I'm sorry to hear that your line is compromised now, and that's the exact reason I started this thread. I know there are breeders that are dedicated to sorting through the muck and establishing pure lines if possible, even if it means a higher volume of animals that may be a bit less desirable. Next year I'll be breeding at least two of my males to diablo blancos to be sure to flush out even more information, meaning I'll have a pile of triple hets to move into the market, not an ideal "business" strategy, but completely necessary from the standpoint of maintaining integrity.

Justin, I hear you loud and clear, which is why I am test breeding those big males. And yes, I paid a pretty penny for them! All part of the game in my book.

 

[Kristi23]

I try to only buy from breeders that I trust, so I haven't really done any test breeding. So far there have been no surprises.

 

[Laska]

Over the years I have prided myself on keeping my recessive trait geckos pure, even when people gave me a bunch of crap about 'old-school' morphs. I learned a very painful lesson in trust from a large-scale breeder who guaranteed the pure genetics of a female I purchased to outcross my line. Now, after 14 years of careful selective breeding, a pure GGG line is corrupt. Quite frankly I don't know who to trust anymore. It goes deeper than that, because I believe the vast majority of leopard geckos out there today have hidden genetic traits from indiscriminate morph-making... whether we are aware of it or not. This is why I am a H-U-G-E proponent of full disclosure of everything you know about any gecko's lineage. At least people could make informed decisions when chosing geckos for their projects and not have 14 years of work disintegrate.

Total agreement! Couldnt have put it better. FULL DISCLOSURE helps everyone out, and asking tons of ?'s when buying gives you the upperhand in a expensive purchase especially. Sorry Marcia about your line, sad to see that happen to anyone.