Info on Crypto from Ron Tremper

[marula]

I'd like to know if any European breeder has been notified of any case of crypto.

a friend of mine, in italy,lost something like 25 geckos for crypto (he quarantine ALL his new arrive and he think problably somebody coming by fededers) and in italy is a common problem in geckos from petshops...

He confirmed that it is totally false that all Leopard Geckos have crypto. He said that all reptiles have a small level of coccidia in their GI systems, and stress levels and improper husbandry can cause cause immuno-suppression which can result in those 'normal' levels growing out of control into a full-blown infection, but NOT crypto.

i 100% agree with this...for what i know geckos and dogs (the 2 kind of animals i working with) have a small level of coccidia that can appear for stress or improper care... (Dr. Frederic L. Frye will came to an italian university for a conference...i hope to eb able to partecipate)...

btw...if you quarantine in the right way your addictions (90 days! in another room..if you have in another building..), if you controll your feeders before give them to your geckos (so don't give them the day after thir arrive), if you donìt change bowls, humid box, and cage set up from a cage to another, and if you take the right care of your geckos, is really difficult to have crypto problem...
probably a gecko stressed from a bad care or feeder with bad food and cages with others have some more possibilities to be "carrier" ...and shiiping is a really best moment for stress a geckos and see his healty problem appear...

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

Marula, I thinks it's a good idea to note that crypto CAN be spread through feeders, but only if uneaten crickets are taken out of an infected gecko's enclosure and fed to another gecko. Since crypto is spread by oral/fecal contact, the crickets will eat the infected leos feces and if that insect is eaten by another gecko, it can become infected, too.

I know of a breeder many years ago that lost his entire colony to crypto by recycling uneaten feeders.

 

[marula]

I know of a breeder many years ago that lost his entire colony to crypto by recycling uneaten feeders.

that is the poit! thanks
...and this is the reason why i put in the trash all worms and cricketts i found around the cage uneated...i think is a good rule...

 

[preacherman]

As always, thanks for the great post, Marcia. I appreciate you sharing your thoughts and experiences with us. I do have a couple of questions for you, though. In your opinion, how effective is a 90 day quarantine? Can a gecko carry crypto and appear to be perfectly healthy for a period longer than 90 days? If so, then how do we ever really ensure that we're not infecting our colonies by bringing in new animals?

 

[bleeding_sarcasm]

I invited Dr. Harkewicz to be a guest on our chat to discuss crypto, and he said he'd think about it. He says he can't type that fast... LOL!

Dr. Harkewicz is our vet too, and he is really fantastic. That would be great if he could join us for a chat!

 

[Sandra]

It would be very interesting that an experienced vet joined us! I hope you can persuade him!

But now I have the same question as Jason... How can you be sure your animal is not infected just by quarantining? I don't plan to introduce my male to my female until a year or more has passed, but what if crypto or other illnesses can be in a latent state their whole lives?

a friend of mine, in italy,lost something like 25 geckos for crypto (he quarantine ALL his new arrive and he think problably somebody coming by fededers) and in italy is a common problem in geckos from petshops...

That sucks a lot... I'm sorry for your friend. If it is a common problem in Italy, I guess it has spread here too, and people just don't mention it because of ignorance.

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

In your opinion, how effective is a 90 day quarantine? Can a gecko carry crypto and appear to be perfectly healthy for a period longer than 90 days? If so, then how do we ever really ensure that we're not infecting our colonies by bringing in new animals?

Good question, and one I don't have the answer for. My personal opinion is that a 90-day quarantine is sufficient for problems such as pinworms, hookworms, protozoan and bacterial infections, and coccidia. I don't think we really know enough about how long it would take to see if crypto rears it's ugly head.

I guess it has spread here too, and people just don't mention it because of ignorance.

It could be ignorance, but I honestly think that when crypto affects someone's colony it strikes such fear in the hearts of reptile keepers and it could mean losing all of their animals as well as their business. It would be like having the bubonic plague...

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

Dr. Harkewicz is our vet too, and he is really fantastic. That would be great if he could join us for a chat!

I just got an email from Dr. Harkewicz, and it sounds like he is open to an organized chat!!! His schedule is very tight, so I told him we could work within his time restraints.

 

[Intense Herpetoculture]

One thing we have to remember is that practically all the animals we are working with came from bloodlines of big breeders. In the mid-nineties many breeders had huge colonies of leopard geckos devastated by crypto. Thne animals which survived make up a good portion of the breeding stock we use now. So are these animals resistant to crypto, but still infected? I think many are. They do not show symptoms unless put under times of stress.

Crypto often requires a necropsy for identification. Unless the crypto has been shed in large numbers, the point where symptoms usually occur, it will not appear in fecals; otherwise, it can only be found in the lining of the intestines.

I've had some very healthy geckos from several well-known breeders, with repeated negative fecals, that I raised from hatchlings. After a time, when moved into larger enclosures or introduced into multi-animal environments, they succumbed to crypto, which my vet confirmed through necropsy. The animals that were placed in multi-animal enclosures were placed only with other animals which had been healthy before, so we're not talking about a matter of contraction. I regularly test fecal matter, so I'm not basing the health of the animal on appearance alone. I monitor the health of all my animals, and thankfully, I have very few problems, so when something like crypto just "appears," I question it. I am not the only breeder in this position, either, so I know it's not the mysterious "Justyn" strand. Whew.

This is a subject everyone is afraid to talk about, but given my own experience, I believe that crypto is found in more leos that we think, and lies dormant, thankfully, in most. I understand I'm not a vet, but I have talked to several very knowledgeable vets who agree. I don't think this issue has reached it's climax, but in the next several years we'll know more and be able to make a better judgment. Herp health is a funny thing. Look at coccidia and bearded dragons.

 

[BalloonzForU]

http://www.geckoforums.net/showpost.php?p=40515&postcount=6

 

[wsmitty]

I use laboratory-grade quaternary ammonium compound to disinfect ALL my bowls, hides, and tubs. Ammonia at this concentration is the only compound known to eradicate cryptosoridium on non-porous surfaces. (It even kills the AIDS virus).

Wow! What brand do you use? I did a Froogle search and found something called SaniZide Plus.

 

[GroovyGeckos.com]

Believe there is a brand named Quat.

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

Yes, QUATS is a type of quaternary ammonium compound. The brand I use is laboratory-grade that I get from my connections after many years as a Chemical Engineer, LOL! Actually, 10% ammonia (the kind you get at the store is 10% right out of the bottle) will also kill cryptosporidium. Keep in mind that any ammonia-based produce requires proper ventilation, and needs to be rinsed, rinsed, and rinsed again.

 

[Russ S]

Marcia,

Can't I just use bleach to get the ammonia off the items I have soaked with ammonia?

 

[GroovyGeckos.com]

Russ, I know you must be kidding. That will actually kill you!!

Some type of gas is produced by mixing the two.:main_yes: Forget what it is, but it is not pleasant, and quite a bit, more harmful than either one.

 

[GroovyGeckos.com]

OK Im back and ready for Russ, here:main_laugh:

 

[BalloonzForU]

Marcia,

Can't I just use bleach to get the ammonia off the items I have soaked with ammonia?

LMAO

 

[Russ S]

Russ, I know you must be kidding. That will actually kill you!!

Yes Dan I was kidding ... the last thing I need to do is produce toxic gasses by mixing chemicals. Robin thinks I produce enough toxic gasses as it is.

 

[GroovyGeckos.com]

Thank goodness! lol

Robin thinks I produce enough toxic gasses as it is.

May end you up in the doghouse. Literaly.:main_laugh:

 

[Russ S]

Well at least it's a spacious doghouse, approximately 4' x 8'. I can fit in it nicely and still have room for the dog.