Is she a giant????

[Jordan]

I'm fairly certain that Maia was annoyed because Mr. gecko CLEARLY ignored the contents of her helpful post and asked the question. It was a simple question, but an ignorant and stupid one in regards to the previous contents of this thread. I would be annoyed as well.

Agreed, im with Maia on it. The question was answered before it was asked.

 

[Dog Shrink]

THIS arguement right here is why ALL breeders should be required to make pedigrees for their breeding animals and offspring. ANY animal that is bred, not just mammals. It removes all doubt and it is truly the only way to know the lineage aside of word of mouth. We aren't indians, we don't need to tell stories to remember history... we have technology to do that for us. USE it. IMO it would certainly make any breeder look a heck of a lot more crediblein my eyes. Pedigree'd Gecko for sale... YAY I know the parentage despite what the idiot breeder might misquote from the last breeder. Think about it, it would have also resolved the las vegas rainwater arguement as well... wow something so simple and done on just about every purebred animal EXCEPT herps... herps need to catch up. Aside of clarifying lineage it also makes for BREEDER ACCOUNTABILITY... those animals can be traced back to their breeders and blame can be placed where it should. If (and that is a HUGE if) I ever breed I most certainly will be making pedigrees for my stock.

 

[Jordan]

well tbh Proper respectable breeder KNOW their stock and know the genetics and so dont need a pedigree.

But its the bad ones that lose track of eggs and stuff or just dont know the genetics and shouldnt be bought from.
why buy a gecko from a breeder that doesnt even know the geckos parents. or its morph or its hets or anything.
If poeple stop buying from these breeders then we will be left with only the good trustable ones and pedigrees wont be needed.
But until then Kel, then yes, damn right. lol

 

[Dog Shrink]

Even the respectable breeders that know their stock Im sure have to write it down somewhere as there is truly too much to go simply on memory alone. Pedigrees mean accountability, accountability means responsibility, and responsibility is what seperates the schlep profit breeders from the true herp enthusiast that is trying to creat something new and exciting. I would still do pedigrees even if i were looked at like some freak. No one could EVER question my genetics.

 

[ddkgeckos]

well tbh Proper respectable breeder KNOW their stock and know the genetics and so dont need a pedigree.

But its the bad ones that lose track of eggs and stuff or just dont know the genetics and shouldnt be bought from.
why buy a gecko from a breeder that doesnt even know the geckos parents. or its morph or its hets or anything.
If poeple stop buying from these breeders then we will be left with only the good trustable ones and pedigrees wont be needed.
But until then Kel, then yes, damn right. lol

Human are allowed to make mistakes, im sure you will at some point mix your eggs up or something similar. The breeder i got her from is a well respected breeder here in the uk and im sure you would of heard of him jordan but i aint gonna name names. Also to answer your first point i didnt buy this gecko because it may be a giant infact the term giant was not even mentioned when i got her. But i get your point in why buy something that may be a giant when you can buy something thats is 100% sure.

Sying that a breeder is a bad one because he/she may lose track of eggs is very wrong. Its ironic that your saying all this about geckos being labelled correctly yet you where happy to add a new morph to leowiki even though it is not. This in my books makes you a worse breeder as your trying to sell something under a name when infact its not.

 

[Jordan]

Human are allowed to make mistakes, im sure you will at some point mix your eggs up or something similar. The breeder i got her from is a well respected breeder here in the uk and im sure you would of heard of him jordan but i aint gonna name names. Also to answer your first point i didnt buy this gecko because it may be a giant infact the term giant was not even mentioned when i got her. But i get your point in why buy something that may be a giant when you can buy something thats is 100% sure.

Yes fair point, and if its the breeder im thinking of then as much as ive found him very helpful and a nice guy, he's had a lot of problems like this. But thats if its the same guy im thinking you mean.
And when i said 'why buy something...' i meant in general not you specifically, i suppose i used you as an example and i apologise for assuming.

Sying that a breeder is a bad one because he/she may lose track of eggs is very wrong. Its ironic that your saying all this about geckos being labelled correctly yet you where happy to add a new morph to leowiki even though it is not. This in my books makes you a worse breeder as your trying to sell something under a name when infact its not.

If a breeder is constantly losing track of eggs and often doesnt know the genetics of his animals then... well yeh its a bad breeder.


And cheap shot but fine i was eager, but never sold anything labelled incorrectly.

Im going to assume you mean 'super creamsicles' ... i never sold any under this name... but if you was sold a 'super creamsicle'... hmm i wonder what the genetics of this animal could be..? its not hard. Its like shortening mack snow bell albino to mack bell. doesnt take much figuring out.
However 'urgh i dunno i got its egg mixed up' doesnt ghelp at all with genetics.

 

[Dog Shrink]

Any GOOD breeder sure as heck should know how to NOT mix up their eggs... that's a beginner mistake. They should have fail safes in place to ensure that doesn't happen. After all it IS their reputation at stake... could you see some one like Ron Tremper saying "Oh I think it's this but Im not sure because I mixed up the eggs"... heck no... he'd be laughed out of the fancy so fast... A good breeder, a TRULY good breeder does NOT allow themselves to "lose track of/mix up eggs" and be made to look a fool..

 

[ddkgeckos]

If a breeder is constantly losing track of eggs and often doesnt know the genetics of his animals then... well yeh its a bad breeder.

And cheap shot but fine i was eager, but never sold anything labelled incorrectly.

Where has constantly come from for all you know this could be the only time he has done this in the 30 years hes been breeding leopard geckos.

humans make mistakes especially when you have hundreds of leo eggs to label i imagine it can be quite easy to stick a label on the wrong tub every now and then. But we woudl not know that as both of us are small scale breeders we dont do it on the scale that this guy does.

As for the cheap shot, you say you where eager, yet you havent taken it down from the website??????

 

[Jordan]

Where has constantly come from for all you know this could be the only time he has done this in the 30 years hes been breeding leopard geckos.

humans make mistakes especially when you have hundreds of leo eggs to label i imagine it can be quite easy to stick a label on the wrong tub every now and then. But we woudl not know that as both of us are small scale breeders we dont do it on the scale that this guy does.

As for the cheap shot, you say you where eager, yet you havent taken it down from the website??????

As Kel said, if you were a large scale breeder, you have the responsibility to NOT mix up eggs. NOT to send a gecko into the community with unknown genetics cuz heck there's plenty already.


Its a wiki, feel free to take it off if you disagree with it.

 

[fl_orchidslave]

Pet shops will buy wholesale lots of mixed up baby geckos because genetics means nothing to them. Just a buck.

 

[ddkgeckos]

As Kel said, if you were a large scale breeder, you have the responsibility to NOT mix up eggs. NOT to send a gecko into the community with unknown genetics cuz heck there's plenty already.


Its a wiki, feel free to take it off if you disagree with it.

Its not for me to take it off jordan thats for you to do.

As for sending a gecko into the communtiy with unsure genetics, i was told that there was a mix up with the eggs and was told what it could possibly be, Giant was not mentioned but tbf i looked at a lot of geckos that day and kinda had information overload. I took the gecko knowing it was a unsure morph and i will be breeding it to find out what exactly it is. I don think thats irresponsible he told me the story and i agreed to buy it regardless a bad breeder would not of told me that and i would of probably had a shock when something hatched out i didnt expect. Again if you knew who this breeder was you would not be saying this. Infact you have probably drawled over his geckos many times. Kim and mark bell hatched out the enigma yet they did not know exactly who where its parents they only knew what group it came from. Things like this happen alot especially with large scale breeders, it does not make them bad breeders.

 

[Dog Shrink]

And again... THIS is why breeders NEED pedigrees... it removes all question or doubt.

 

[Jordan]

Its not for me to take it off jordan thats for you to do.

As for sending a gecko into the communtiy with unsure genetics, i was told that there was a mix up with the eggs and was told what it could possibly be, Giant was not mentioned but tbf i looked at a lot of geckos that day and kinda had information overload. I took the gecko knowing it was a unsure morph and i will be breeding it to find out what exactly it is. I don think thats irresponsible he told me the story and i agreed to buy it regardless a bad breeder would not of told me that and i would of probably had a shock when something hatched out i didnt expect. Again if you knew who this breeder was you would not be saying this. Infact you have probably drawled over his geckos many times. Kim and mark bell hatched out the enigma yet they did not know exactly who where its parents they only knew what group it came from. Things like this happen alot especially with large scale breeders, it does not make them bad breeders.

No, the whole point of a wiki is that ANYONE can edit it, go ahead.

okay so he made a mistake, and you chose to buy it. Fair enough i agree then, mistakes happen BUT:

The responsible breeder would have test bred it before sending it out there with unknown genetics.

 

[yellermelon]

Everyone makes mistakes. Egg mixups do happen especially if you have a vast number. I think this thread has gotton terribly off course and is not doing anybody good.

 

[striker]

He looks ok but are you watching what she is eating cause it could affect her weight
if you are worried you might want to switch her diet

 

[striker]

She looks good might want to swich her diet if you are worried

 

[KelliH]

Any GOOD breeder sure as heck should know how to NOT mix up their eggs... that's a beginner mistake. They should have fail safes in place to ensure that doesn't happen. After all it IS their reputation at stake... could you see some one like Ron Tremper saying "Oh I think it's this but Im not sure because I mixed up the eggs"... heck no... he'd be laughed out of the fancy so fast... A good breeder, a TRULY good breeder does NOT allow themselves to "lose track of/mix up eggs" and be made to look a fool..

Not true, it's happened to all of us. We are human and make mistakes sometimes. Even Ron Tremper.

 

[KelliH]

Everyone makes mistakes. Egg mixups do happen especially if you have a vast number. I think this thread has gotton terribly off course and is not doing anybody good.

I think you're right, Chris.
Guys, please stop with the snide remarks to each other. This website is about helping each other out, remember.

 

[Jordan]

I agree that all breeders make mistakes thats fair enough... however i think its the responsibility of the breeder that IF he makes the mistake then he shouldnt THEN go and release the animal that he doesnt know the genetics of... He should test breed or keep it.

That was not meant to sound argumentative, im hoping this can be discussed nicely

 

[AMetallica]

Everyone makes mistakes. Egg mixups do happen especially if you have a vast number. I think this thread has gotton terribly off course and is not doing anybody good.

By now, I think it's 99% proven that there was a mix-up and the OP got a giant. But anyways, this thread's doing me some good. *sips coffee @ Starbucks* Nothing like an alternative for reading a book- a good forum argument.