James Hill BAD BAD BAD

[Valley Reptiles]

http://www.pangeareptile.com/forums/showthread.php?p=68392&posted=1#post68392

oh he got back to me...told me and i quote "Go to hell, there was nothing wrong with the gecko the. You cant see his "tail twisted" because it wasnt."

I wasn't the one who saw the twist, you people with better eyes caught that. And I hate using PMS that people send...I think it's technically unethical...but once you start pulling off the gloves like he is...well....

That response was after I saw my name blasted on the forums before I could contact her and after other responses between me and her. There was more to it than just "go to hell"

 

[Valley Reptiles]

It's really a shame that there are so many bad people within the reptile community. I can't bring myself to buy anything from someone I don't know anymore because of all the horror stories I've heard, I'm just glad this gecko has a good home with you. If that geckos tail is not twisted then I think I should get new glasses, since they must be distorting the pictures! :wideeyed:

The pictures were not distorted. the tail was not twisted in the picture or when i had him.

 

[Valley Reptiles]

Tonya, can you post the emails you've sent him and his replies here. That link doesn't work.

Yes, in the picture you can see that the tail is bent at the base, but he should have noted the kinked tail in the ad or at least told you before you bought him. It is the sellers responsibility to disclose anything about the animals for sale. Some people do make honest mistakes, like not noticing small imperfections, but that Geckos tail is a mess. He should be ashamed of himself for selling that gecko like that without telling you.

Don't even get me started on the heat packs. :main_angry: Some people should not have animals at all.

If the tail was kinked when I had him, he wouldnt have been for sale. The tail was bent at the base because his tail was curled around the wood. :main_rolleyes:

 

[Valley Reptiles]

So it's been a few days -- any updates?

Update.
She needed the gecko shipped on the 23rd or 24th, I got the payment on the 24th. I work everyday except sunday. DHL was scheduled to be at my house at 2 pm to pick up the package. I got off at 1 pm, went to a friends house to get some heat packs from him. He said they were 24 hour heat packs. By the time i got home it was 1:45 and had to rush to get him ready before they picked him up. I did not look at the label on the heat pack I just assumed that they were 24 hour like he said.

When I saw that they were 10 hour packs I PMed her that second, and she can post that. So she was offered a free male sarasinorum or an unsexed gargoyle (when it's above freezing, i'm not shipping in that kind of cold again).
So she will get a nice unsexed gargoyle soon. All it took was to contact me about it and it would have been taken care of that day by refund, another gecko or whatever, but another member told me about the thread on pangea and i didnt know anything was wrong until i saw that. My phone number was on the DHL shipping slip, my email address on my website.

 

[Valley Reptiles]

http://www.geckoforums.net/showthread.php?p=49770#post49770

Just to let everyone have a heads up. He offers to-good-to-be-true prices on many of his herps.

and just to clear up the to-good-to-be-true animals. Here's pics of what i'm working with right now. Most are from top breeders (anthony caponetto, allen repashy, derek dunlop) and i have spent a lot of time and money on my geckos and their care. and i'm sure most people would get a little defensive if you saw your name being thrown all over the place for bad care and had no idea it was happening.

males

females

4 coming from repashy stock c/o LAC when weather warms

the free gecko she's getting

 

[Val]

If I needed a 24 heat pack and only could get my hands on a 10 hour, I would not ship. Simple as that. I'm sure any responsible reptile owner would rather wait a few more days to get their geckos than put the animal at risk.

 

[Valley Reptiles]

If I needed a 24 heat pack and only could get my hands on a 10 hour, I would not ship. Simple as that. I'm sure any responsible reptile owner would rather wait a few more days to get their geckos than put the animal at risk.

OK. Like i said in my other post. I DID NOT know it was a 10 hour heat pack. I asked for 24 hour and i got these. The animal is at risk anytime it's being shipped especially in 20 degree weather.

 

[Val]

They said hot hands 2 on them. They're individually wrapped and clearly states heats up to 10 hours on them. I don't think hot hands even makes anything that heats up to 20 hours. I just don't see how you could NOT know the heat packs were for 10 hour use.

And yes, you're right that there is a risk shipping animals anytime, especially at the lower temps. That is why we do not ship unless it is a certain temperature. It's up to the seller when they're shipped, and if I don't feel comfortable, the animal doesn't leave my care.

 

[Valley Reptiles]

They said hot hands 2 on them. They're individually wrapped and clearly states heats up to 10 hours on them. I don't think hot hands even makes anything that heats up to 20 hours. I just don't see how you could NOT know the heat packs were for 10 hour use.

And yes, you're right that there is a risk shipping animals anytime, especially at the lower temps. That is why we do not ship unless it is a certain temperature. It's up to the seller when they're shipped, and if I don't feel comfortable, the animal doesn't leave my care.

It's very simple to NOT know they were 10 hours as I already explained it. I dont use hot hands. I dont go searching on the internet to read about Hot hands 2. I was out of heat packs and had to pick one up from a friend. I asked for 24 hour heat packs. When I got home I had a total of 15 minutes to get the gecko out of the cage, get him packed, get her address so reading over at a little package wasnt even on my mind.

 

[Jeanne]

I did not look at the label on the heat pack I just assumed that they were 24 hour like he said.

When I saw that they were 10 hour packs I PMed her that second, and she can post that.

OK. Like i said in my other post. I DID NOT know it was a 10 hour heat pack. I asked for 24 hour and i got these. The animal is at risk anytime it's being shipped especially in 20 degree weather.

It's very simple to NOT know they were 10 hours as I already explained it. I dont use hot hands. I dont go searching on the internet to read about Hot hands 2. I was out of heat packs and had to pick one up from a friend. I asked for 24 hour heat packs. When I got home I had a total of 15 minutes to get the gecko out of the cage, get him packed, get her address so reading over at a little package wasnt even on my mind.

It is CLEARLY stated on the package that they are 10 hour, not sure how you missed that (See picture of the heat pack package below). Even if you did miss it, that is no excuse, yes we all make mistakes, but it is your responsibility to make sure that the Gecko is properly packaged for shipping.

If you didn't feel comfortable shipping in the cold weather, then you shouldn't have done so. If that means losing a sale, then so be it. The animals life is what's important.

That response was after I saw my name blasted on the forums before I could contact her and after other responses between me and her. There was more to it than just "go to hell"

That wasn't very nice no matter how much more to it there was. What ever happened to Customer Service?

The pictures were not distorted. the tail was not twisted in the picture or when i had him.

How does a Geckos tail get that messed up in a 24 hour period?

 

[Valley Reptiles]

It is CLEARLY stated on the package that they are 10 hour, not sure how you missed that (See picture of the heat pack package below). Even if you did miss it, that is no excuse, yes we all make mistakes, but it is your responsibility to make sure that the Gecko is properly packaged for shipping.


Like i have said over and over. I did not have much time to get him ready so i did not read the package.

If you didn't feel comfortable shipping in the cold weather, then you shouldn't have done so. If that means losing a sale, then so be it. The animals life is what's important.

I never feel comfortable shipping anytime. She said that she has gotten others in when it was cold with no problems so i shipped.





That wasn't very nice no matter how much more to it there was. What ever happened to Customer Service?

Some of the things she said wasnt very nice either. Customer Service can only go so far. Customer Service is taking time out of my hours at work to get home and ship a gecko when the customer wanted it. Customer Service IS NOT just sitting around keeping your mouth shut when someone is writing untrue things about me on the forums before i could even respond to her.




How does a Geckos tail get that messed up in a 24 hour period?

How do you know the tail wasnt altered to look that bad in the pictures???? I still have some doubts about it but I did apologise to her and offer to make it better by giving her another gecko. That is the customer service you were talking about.

pictures of him right before he was sent. If i knew this was going to happen I would have taken a full shot of the non kinked tail but i didnt know i would be under a microscope because the gecko curled his tail around a piece of wood. :main_robin:

this one shows more of the tail and where the kinks are in her picture, you would see part of them in mine.

this geckos tail is turned like the gargoyle, but not twisted, not kinked.

this one has the same ring at the base but still not twisted or kinked.

I have explained my part. I knew when I came on here there would be some people just like the "fauna boys" and only listen to one side of the story, but i can really care less at this point. I did my part to make it right, nothing more i can do. The truth is everyone is human, everyone will make a mistake, even you. I made the mistake of not reading the package the heat pack was in, I admitted that. I apologised to her for it and I assume that it's ok now after she gets her other gecko that she chose, if not then she can contact me again for a different way to make it better.

 

[robin]

james,
while i do understand and i am trying to see both side. the only thing i can say is. in the second and third photos you can see at the base of the tail and even a bit farther down the tail, what clearly look like kinks.

as far as shipping and receiving, any email correspondence would be helpful.

i understand that at some point there are customers you can not please. but everyone is different in what they expect and how much they can handle. and then some people just don't handle it or handle it poorly. again emails would be helpful in telling the extent of your customer service.
just some thoughts and suggestions

 

[Jeremy Letkey]

I made the mistake of not reading the package the heat pack was in, I admitted that. I apologised to her for it and I assume that it's ok now after she gets her other gecko that she chose, if not then she can contact me again for a different way to make it better. end of story, deal over, Thank you.

James I do believe that all this could have went smoother if this would have been your initial post. If you simply remove the "end of story, deal over" portion of it.

You are right, we all make mistakes, it is how we deal with those mistakes that defines us.

I hope that you can better yourself by learning from this.
Good luck with your dealings in the future.

 

[Valley Reptiles]

james,
while i do understand and i am trying to see both side. the only thing i can say is. in the second and third photos you can see at the base of the tail and even a bit farther down the tail, what clearly look like kinks.

as far as shipping and receiving, any email correspondence would be helpful.

i understand that at some point there are customers you can not please. but everyone is different in what they expect and how much they can handle. and then some people just don't handle it or handle it poorly. again emails would be helpful in telling the extent of your customer service.
just some thoughts and suggestions

I dont see the kinks anywhere in any of the pictures. If the tail was as bad as it was when she got it then the kinks would be very noticable. on my pictures you have to search just to find something remotely looking unnormal. And I admit I may have said a couple things i shouldnt have, but I felt that I had to defend myself.
all that bothered me was that she didnt wait until i could contact her and work it out and I had to hear from another Pangea member to know about the thread. I'm not blaming her in any way, I'm just trying to prove my point that it was a mistake, I truely did not know they were 10 hr packs and the tail wasnt bad.

I never got an email from her. They were all by PM on Pangea.

This is a link to the last few PMs after I saw the heat packs were 10 hour and tried to work something out.
http://pangeareptile.com/forums/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=42381

 

[Valley Reptiles]

James I do believe that all this could have went smoother if this would have been your initial post. If you simply remove the "end of story, deal over" portion of it.

You are right, we all make mistakes, it is how we deal with those mistakes that defines us.

I hope that you can better yourself by learning from this.
Good luck with your dealings in the future.

sorry, will do. I didnt mean it bad, just the deal is done, we worked out a resalution to the problem.

 

[Jeanne]

This is a link to the last few PMs after I saw the heat packs were 10 hour and tried to work something out.
http://pangeareptile.com/forums/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=42381

We can't view your PM's, can you copy and paste them here?

Thanks

 

[Valley Reptiles]

01-27-2007, 11:13 PM
perefalcon
Jill????? Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Michigan
Posts: 82
Rep Power: 0



Re: male garg

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Quote:
Originally Posted by firecrested
Quote:
Originally Posted by perefalcon
Quote:
Originally Posted by firecrested
you want to keep this by the rules, fine. Here's where it was taken.

http://www.geckoforums.net/showthrea...9877#post49877


SO i picked up another set of heat packs and they are 10 hour so I apologise for that part, i bought 3 from someone that was suppose to be 24 hour heat packs. but the tail really wasnt like that when i sent him.

I still dont think it was right going on the forums before I was able to respond to you, but like i said on the forums, I TRY TO WORK WITH MY CUSTOMERS and seeing that it was 10 hour heat packs and not 24 hour then it is partly my fault. So you will be getting a free gecko from me. this time it will have to be at least above freezing before I ship another gecko. I dont want to risk the health of another one.
you can choose from my unsexed gargoyle or you can wait until I get my shipment of Allen Repashy's geckos in and take a male sarasinorum.

I would have posted this on the gecko forums site but they did not approve my account yet so i cant post.


Thank you for letting me know that you at least realized that those were not 24 hour packs...since I don't have any experience with Sarasinorum or plan on working with them in the near future, I would be happy to accept the unsexed gargoyle. Just let me know when you plan to ship him.


ok.
i checked your weather tonight and it looks like it's going to get very cold this week. whenever it gets back to 33 degrees or higher i'll ship.[/quote]

that sounds fine
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[robin]

I dont see the kinks anywhere in any of the pictures. If the tail was as bad as it was when she got it then the kinks would be very noticable. on my pictures you have to search just to find something remotely looking unnormal. And I admit I may have said a couple things i shouldnt have, but I felt that I had to defend myself.
all that bothered me was that she didnt wait until i could contact her and work it out and I had to hear from another Pangea member to know about the thread. I'm not blaming her in any way, I'm just trying to prove my point that it was a mistake, I truely did not know they were 10 hr packs and the tail wasnt bad.

I never got an email from her. They were all by PM on Pangea.

This is a link to the last few PMs after I saw the heat packs were 10 hour and tried to work something out.
http://pangeareptile.com/forums/private.php?do=showpm&pmid=42381

i don't think the tail in your picture looks as bad as the ones jill posted but stress can be a factor as you know but in your photos and i am blind as poopy i can even see two places of kinking but they look slight and not like the photos jill took but again like i said earlier stress can cause many different problems. (stress in shipping, the cold weather etc.)


but i am glad you and jill have resolved this issue.
hopefully we can get an update from her

 

[robin]

01-27-2007, 11:13 PM


ok.
i checked your weather tonight and it looks like it's going to get very cold this week. whenever it gets back to 33 degrees or higher i'll ship.

personally the lowest temps i will ship in is no lower than 40 degrees at night and that is with heat packs

 

[Jeremy Letkey]

James, I think that you are getting the point but I am not quite certain. All I can do is tell you how I would have handled this situation.

I would not have responded on the forums at all. I would have made direct contact with the customer and made amends. Regardless of the condition of the gecko before it left my care. I would have offered a replacement or refund. The animal is my responsibility until the customer accepts it.

Tonya, I think it was in poor judgement to go public as quickly as you did. Did you try to make direct contact with the seller prior to the public posts? It is my opinion that the seller should be given adequate time to work the problem out with the customer.

I'll say that I have had a few mishaps that were my fault. I'd like to think that no one but myself and my customers will ever know about them. Why, because I admitted my mistakes and rectified them to the customers satisfaction. Your reputation is the most valuable asset in this hobby.