herpencounter
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I saved it let me find it...
herpencounter
Herpencounter.com
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I would still like to see the post Baoh was talking about. Might make more since then what I said.
OK… Lets see….
I hate to be wrong that’s why I did not post this. Don’t rag on me if you think there is something wrong with what I said. Just say why you don’t think will work and I will try and clarify what I said…
Genes make proteins.
A recessive gene in the heterozygous forum cant produce X protein. Only in the homozygous forum can they produce X protein.
Dominant genes in the heterozygous or homozygous produce the same amount of X protein.
Co-dominant is the word we use for a halfway point (this is the herp community being very ignorant… we have no idea if these genes that we call co-dom are co-dom, incomplete dominance, less then dominance, over dominance and countless other names) The heterozygous forum does not produce the full amount of X protein and the homozygous forum does produce the full amount of X proteins.
This can also work the other way around too, it STOPS a protein from being produced. Such as in Mack snows, TUGs and, gems.
Now this is what I think is going on…
The TUG, Gem and, Mack snows genes are located on the same allele (they have to be they all reduce yellow pigment and I doubt there are two alleles that produce yellow/red pigment). The dominant TUG and gem reduce X protein (I don’t know what protein is used to produce yellow/red pigment so I will use X) by a certain amount lets say that amount is 75% (not saying it is 75% but they do not get as yellow as macks sometimes do). Lets say that the heterozygous Mack snow reduces the production of X protein by 50%. It does not stop the production of X protein but, reduces the production of X protein (which is why you see a little yellow).
Mack X Mack.
Normal. Produce the normal amount of X protein.
Heterozygous Macks. Reduce X protein by 50%.
Homozygous Mack. Completely stop the production of X protein.
Mack X gem or TUG (lets use TUG)
Normal. Produce the normal amount of X protein.
Heterozygous Macks. Reduce X protein by 50%.
Heterozygous TUG. Reduce X protein by 75%.
TUG Mack super snow. Completely stop the production of X protein.
The reason you get that typical color is… Well I don’t know… If you want my opinion here it is… It has always baffled me how the homozygous super snow always have black spots… You can breed the two whitest hypo snows you have and still get a super snow with black spots all over. Hypo mean less, so I assume it mean less pattern… I actually don’t know a whole lot about the “hypo gene” come to think of it… is it stopping the black spot on geckos from being shown or, are the black spot there and the orange/yellow/red is just sitting on top of it (if that makes any since). And because the Mack snow removes the yellow/red pigment… That is why you see all the black spots in the super snow…. Hmm…
Or it could be… when you completely stop the production of yellow/red pigment that’s what you get…
OK! I hope you understand what I was saying. That was my entire thought process when I came up with this. So please explain anything I did not understand.
I don’t know of anybody that has crossed these but, I do have an explanation on why you WOULDN’T get a super snow. You might lose all yellow pigment but…
The reason I did not want to say anything is because most of this is speculation then actual fact… I have absolutely NO experience with anything I said. Although all of what I said (to my knowledge) is completely possible.
I am not very good at transferring thoughts into words. Sorry if it is a big jumble of unrecognizable sentences. Lol….
OK… Lets see….
I hate to be wrong that’s why I did not post this. Don’t rag on me if you think there is something wrong with what I said. Just say why you don’t think will work and I will try and clarify what I said…
Genes make proteins.
A recessive gene in the heterozygous forum cant produce X protein. Only in the homozygous forum can they produce X protein.
Dominant genes in the heterozygous or homozygous produce the same amount of X protein.
Co-dominant is the word we use for a halfway point (this is the herp community being very ignorant… we have no idea if these genes that we call co-dom are co-dom, incomplete dominance, less then dominance, over dominance and countless other names) The heterozygous forum does not produce the full amount of X protein and the homozygous forum does produce the full amount of X proteins.
This can also work the other way around too, it STOPS a protein from being produced. Such as in Mack snows, TUGs and, gems.
Now this is what I think is going on…
The TUG, Gem and, Mack snows genes are located on the same allele (they have to be they all reduce yellow pigment and I doubt there are two alleles that produce yellow/red pigment). The dominant TUG and gem reduce X protein (I don’t know what protein is used to produce yellow/red pigment so I will use X) by a certain amount lets say that amount is 75% (not saying it is 75% but they do not get as yellow as macks sometimes do). Lets say that the heterozygous Mack snow reduces the production of X protein by 50%. It does not stop the production of X protein but, reduces the production of X protein (which is why you see a little yellow).
Mack X Mack.
Normal. Produce the normal amount of X protein.
Heterozygous Macks. Reduce X protein by 50%.
Homozygous Mack. Completely stop the production of X protein.
Mack X gem or TUG (lets use TUG)
Normal. Produce the normal amount of X protein.
Heterozygous Macks. Reduce X protein by 50%.
Heterozygous TUG. Reduce X protein by 75%.
TUG Mack super snow. Completely stop the production of X protein.
The reason you get that typical color is… Well I don’t know… If you want my opinion here it is… It has always baffled me how the homozygous super snow always have black spots… You can breed the two whitest hypo snows you have and still get a super snow with black spots all over. Hypo mean less, so I assume it mean less pattern… I actually don’t know a whole lot about the “hypo gene” come to think of it… is it stopping the black spot on geckos from being shown or, are the black spot there and the orange/yellow/red is just sitting on top of it (if that makes any since). And because the Mack snow removes the yellow/red pigment… That is why you see all the black spots in the super snow…. Hmm…
Or it could be… when you completely stop the production of yellow/red pigment that’s what you get…
OK! I hope you understand what I was saying. That was my entire thought process when I came up with this. So please explain anything I did not understand.
I don’t know of anybody that has crossed these but, I do have an explanation on why you WOULDN’T get a super snow. You might lose all yellow pigment but…
The reason I did not want to say anything is because most of this is speculation then actual fact… I have absolutely NO experience with anything I said. Although all of what I said (to my knowledge) is completely possible.
I am not very good at transferring thoughts into words. Sorry if it is a big jumble of unrecognizable sentences. Lol….
herpencounter
Herpencounter.com
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OOPS! Just realized the second quote I put in there was from before... I made so improvements and forgot to change that lol. But I will tell you what I was thinking... I have noticed in a lot of Macks that the patterns are a little different then they would be if they where not Macks. Jungles are a good example.
LoveGeckos.com
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- UK
Hi
Thank you for your ideas/thoughts, I won't shoot you down. I do however sympathise with you, I also do not like being wrong. I have some cuff links for work, one says "I am always Right" and the other says "I am Never Wrong" :main_yes:
Just to clarify one thing
Are you saying that the above will be gentically the same or act in the same way?
Thanks
Andy
Thank you for your ideas/thoughts, I won't shoot you down. I do however sympathise with you, I also do not like being wrong. I have some cuff links for work, one says "I am always Right" and the other says "I am Never Wrong" :main_yes:
Just to clarify one thing
Are you saying that the above will be gentically the same or act in the same way?
Thanks
Andy
herpencounter
Herpencounter.com
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They are completely different but, act the same. Here is your allele M---M Each M stands for a Mack snow gene.
Here is your Tug Mack super snow T---M.
M---M Homozygous Mack snow.
T---M Heterozygous Mack snow and Heterozygous TUG snow.
Both are super snows written differently.
One is Love one is Amor both mean the same thing. One in English one is Spanish.
The reason most people get confused on why you would get a super snow is because they view it like this.
Two different alleles.
M---m Heterozygous Mack snow.
T---t Heterozygous TUG snow.
Last edited:
LoveGeckos.com
New Member
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- UK
So far so good, this is along my way of thinking.
Lets say I get a Super Snow from pairing a TUG/Mack (I do have a few
). If I were to breed the Super Snow to a WildType, which offspring would you expect?
Now I can tell you that I got all snows. However, what would you expect these snows to be? TUG? Mack? Tack?
I have this year bred the resulting snows back to TUGs, and I have Supers again. So should I conclude that they have all become Macks at this stage? Since we know that TUGs X TUGs only result in TUGs and WildType. Unless you have a homozygous TUG, although within the few years of breeding TUGs together I have not managed to get a one.
Thanks
Andy
Lets say I get a Super Snow from pairing a TUG/Mack (I do have a few
). If I were to breed the Super Snow to a WildType, which offspring would you expect?Now I can tell you that I got all snows. However, what would you expect these snows to be? TUG? Mack? Tack?
I have this year bred the resulting snows back to TUGs, and I have Supers again. So should I conclude that they have all become Macks at this stage? Since we know that TUGs X TUGs only result in TUGs and WildType. Unless you have a homozygous TUG, although within the few years of breeding TUGs together I have not managed to get a one.
Thanks
Andy
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