R.A.P.T.O.R./Eclipse breeding results

[preacherman]

Hello Everyone,

There has been a great deal of misunderstanding and intrigue surrounding the behavior of the genes responsible for pattern and eye color in the Eclipse and R.A.P.T.O.R. morphs. I thought I would post some of our breeding results in hopes of helping to shed some more light on the subject:

*The results of breeding a Snake-eyed Eclipse Male (2 perfect snake-eyes) to a "het" Eclipse female (looks like an Eclipse with normal eyes) were as follows:
1 Eclipse w/one solid black eye and one snake-eye
4 Eclipses w/two snake-eyes

*The results of breeding two A.P.T.O.R.s "het" R.A.P.T.O.R.s together were as follows:
1 jungle albino w/normal eyes
2 A.P.T.O.R.s w/normal eyes
2 R.A.P.T.O.R.s w/solid red eyes

*The results of breeding a solid red-eyed R.A.P.T.O.R. male to A.P.T.O.R. "het" R.A.P.T.O.R. females were as follows:
1 partial reverse stripe w/normal eyes
1 A.P.T.O.R. w/normal eyes
2 R.A.P.T.O.R.s w/two snake-eyes
1 R.A.P.T.O.R. w/solid red eyes
1 partial reverse stripe w/two snake eyes

*The results of breeding a solid red-eyed R.A.P.T.O.R. male to snake-eyed R.A.P.T.O.R. females (each of these females had a very small amount of red pigment in each eye) were as follows:
3 R.A.P.T.O.R.s w/solid red eyes
1 partial reverse stripe w/solid red eyes
2 partial reverse stripes w/one solid and one snake-eye
1 partial reverse stripe w/two snake eyes
6 R.A.P.T.O.R.s w/two snake-eyes

These are just some of our results. We still have quite a few more eggs to hatch this year from our R.A.P.T.O.R./Eclipse project, including solid red eyed R.A.P.T.O.R. x solid red eyed R.A.P.T.O.R.

It should be noted that the eye color is highly succeptible to change during the first month of life. We have had several animals hatch with solid red eyes that faded to some degree. We have also had a few animals hatch with snake-eyes that faded away entirely. In our experience, if the eyes are going to change, they do so during the first month.

I would also like to add that I think that the R.A.P.T.O.R./Eclipse project still has a very bright future. The awesome color of these animals will continue to increase with careful selective breeding.

Feel free to post your own results and/or conclusions, but please don't turn this into a negative thread:main_thumbsup:

 

[GeckoJunkie]

Jason,
Any thoughts on the offspring that the eyes faded as to why they faded? I would be interested in what your thoughts are.

 

[eyelids]

Excellent post Jason! I hope others will add their results to it.

 

[okapi]

Excellent post Jason! I hope others will add their results to it.

Same!

 

[preacherman]

Jason,
Any thoughts on the offspring that the eyes faded as to why they faded? I would be interested in what your thoughts are.

I really don't have any idea. It doesn't happen that often. I think we would have to know exactly what it is that causes the red pigment to be expressed in the eyes in order to understand it.

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

Jason, thank you for taking time to post your results!

 

[Lottiz]

perfect info! Love you

/L

 

[preacherman]

I forgot to mention; we also hatched one snake-eyed animal whose eyes filled in and eventually turned solid red.

 

[Gregg M]

Good post Jason...

The genetics seem to be a bit variable... I am sure with more breeding, things will become even more clear...

 

[Gazz]

Most interesting thanks top stuff :main_thumbsup: this post tells me two things
1/eclipse wheather it's in black and albino form or full or partial it very much recessive.

2/APTOR -AKA-Albino patternless striped the only part that's recessive is the albino the rest maybe some sort of striped / reverse clash type thing after all.

So RAPTOR x RAPTOR doesn't = 100% RAPTOR's.It = 100% albino full or partial eclipse & 100% albino with varyed body morphs.


That RT is a very misleading person as he writes the albino eclipse as RAPTOR writing RAPTOR means the full morph and i bet he knows full well what he's doing when he say's RAPTOR X RAPTOR = 100% RAPTOR not letting on that he's just refering to just the eyes but he doesn't let on TUT TUT.

 

[marula]

i think when the morph is a soooo "complicate" morph (raptor) the kind of bloodline do the difference.
kelli say that her stripe are recessive (i call "her stripe" geckos from her because she say that for studies regarding her geckos), and a ton of striped hatchling start to confirm whant she say this spring (marcia..lotta...etcetc)

 

[preacherman]

I think the gene responsible for the eye color in the R.A.P.T.O.R.s and Eclipses is very similar to the stripes that Kelli is working with. It acts recessive, but it is expressed in different ways/amounts.

 

[GroovyGeckos.com]

Good post, Jason.

So RAPTOR x RAPTOR doesn't = 100% RAPTOR's.

Where did you read this? IF you mean solid eyed X solid eyed, does not = solid eyed:

You have to remember a "snake eye" is nothing special, it is just like a solid eyed "Raptor", and breeding results should follow similarly. All this means is it does not matter if you have two solid eyed geckos, two partial eyed geckos, or one of each, the results will stillvary. I have been saying this all along, and I`m glad to see more results.

The best I have for later this year is Raptor X "het", so I have nothing to ad.

I did experience the eye fade, on one. She started out pretty much like a Raptor, in both eyes, only you could see one half of her eye was slightly different. That half of the eye changed quick, making her a snake eye.

 

[Gazz]

Good post, Jason.

Where did you read this? IF you mean solid eyed X solid eyed, does not = solid eyed:

No i know that ruby eye X ruby eye = 100% ruby eye wheather it be exspressed in full or partial ruby eyes witch is the same result for eclipse but RAPTOR X RAPTOR doesn't = 100% RAPTOR.So why does RT refers to ruby eye as RAPTOR when RAPTOR means the full hog (R)uby eye (A)lbino (P)atternless (T)remper (OR)ange it's only the eye gene & the albino gene that's simple recessive.So why dose he use the full term for a full RAPTOR when he realy refering to just the eye it i a very confusing way to explane things.

 

[GroovyGeckos.com]

So why dose he use the full term for a full RAPTOR when he realy refering to just the eye it i a very confusing way to explane things.

Just to be difficult. :main_laugh: :main_laugh:

 

[tangerineman]

eclipse results

I wish I had more resulkts to share, but hopefully this thread will be kicking around ina few months, i will post my results, and my details...

I am breeding an eclipse with snake eyes (1/2 both eyes...50/50) to a reverse stripe het for eclipse male.
I have four clutches from her and a fifth single egg as the last clutch (?)
I am recording all my breeding temps and durations, etc...

four have hatched , and out of four one was reverse stripe, and one was eclipse with black eyes, the first two may be some sort of stripe variation...???

these were both from the last clutch, so let's hope they keep improving as they have..lol

I have two clutches still incubating for female, and the last single egg incubating for male.
Since I am a big fan of black eyes, stripes, and spots I plan on crossing these with some of my female geckos that are already striped.

I'll let you know when i have some significant info on eye color, hopefully more eclipses are on the way before this batch is done...

:main_thumbsup:

 

[bittner_344]

this is very helpful, as i am breeding APTORS/RAPTORS and hets this summer, thanks alot for putting your time into this!

 

[BluGnat]

this is very helpful, as i am breeding APTORS/RAPTORS and hets this summer, thanks alot for putting your time into this!

Same here!! I hope to be able to add results later. It sounds like one really can't go wrong breeding them - they're going to be pretty no matter what (of course ANY Leo is pretty, no matter what morph...).

 

[godzillizard]

The raptor project is a product of so many traits, it will always produce a ton a variation, and never get boring...It's still (and probably always will be) my favorite project!

Here is my experience so far with breeding (R)aptors:

Solid eyed Raptor male bred to banded albino het Raptor females:
1 solid eyed "patternless stripe" raptor
1 "patternless stripe" Aptor
2 reverse stripe albinos with normal eyes
1 reverse stripe albino with solid red eyes
2 banded albinos with normal eyes

*my snake eyed raptor male bred to banded albino het Raptors produced the same percentage/amount of red eyed offspring as my solid eyed Raptor male

Solid eyed Raptor male bred to Aptor het Raptor females:
1 solid eyed Raptor
2 "patternless stripe" Aptors
1 1 solid eye/and 1 snake eye "patternless stripe" Raptor
2 reverse stripe albinos with partial snake eyes
1 reverse stripe albino with normal eyes

IMO, a (R)aptor is just a really nice Tremper albino that visibly expresses both stripe AND reverse stripe traits--the red eyes occur because the gecko doesn't produce the 'normal' albino eye pigmentation. It's not a gene that causes red pigment to be formed, it simply removes the pigment that is normally present... Brian G