Stripes!?

[herpencounter]

I have been feeling lately the people have been naming the different stripe genes improperly (stripe, reverse stripe, and patter less stripe).

I have been reading up on the stripes for the last few weeks and after looking at multiple sites about stripes, I believe people are improperly naming there stripes (I have seen stripes called reverse stripes and visa versa).

This may not be a big deal to people but it is to me stripes have got to be one of my favorite characteristics.
Where I am seeing the most confusion on the stripes is in the albino forms.

So here is what I have come up for what I believe is the correct definition…

Pattern less stripe:
A pattern less gecko that has come from a stripe/reverse stripe line.

Reverse stripe:
1. A gecko with a light stripe running from head to tail.
and/or
2. A gecko with a light stripe running from head to tail with two darker stripes (right along the edge of the lighter stripe) light sides and then two darker stripes again before you hit the white belly. Example shown below
View attachment 21719

Stripe:
A normal pattern gecko with a stripe running down the back.
Example: Take a normal pattern gecko and erase a line down the center of the back.


I have seen many RAPTORS that fit the description (that I gave) of a reverse stripe.
I have also seen red eyed normal pattern albinos that are called RAPTORS.

Am I just being WAY to specific or am I being reasonable?
Its 2:30 am sorry if I confused anyone =P.

Thanks!

 

[Jeremy Letkey]

Sorry but some of your descriptions are incorrect. Here is a thread that may help out.

http://www.geckoforums.net/showthread.php?t=18629

 

[herpencounter]

Your reverse stripe fit the description I gave of a reverse stripe.

You did not have any pattern less stripes or stripes for me to compare with.

Reverse stripe:
Dark stripe that runs from head to tail.

Stripe:
Light stripe that runs from head to tail.

I don’t know what it is with this gecko but I cant get her pattern to pop…

If you go by the basic definition then both of these would be considers stripes.
But I have seen many available pages that where selling the second gecko pictured as a reverse stripe…

Weather or not I have the definition right, I have compared two of the same pattern geckos and one called it a reverse stripe and others called it stripe.

 

[eyelids]

You're mixing up the two... Yellow color is the pattern and white is the body... Yellow stripe = Stripe and white stripe = Reverse Stripe... A Reverse Stripe essentially has no pattern going down the middle of the gecko... Hence the term REVERSE...

 

[herpencounter]

So what would you call both of my geckos?

 

[herpencounter]

Mhmm I see it now.
Still I don’t under stand why people call RERS, RAPTORs…

And I don’t think it would be right of me to post the sites that have reverse stripes sold as stripes and stripes as reverse stripes ( I am looking at them right now).

Thanks for the help!

 

[GroovyGeckos.com]

The first one(in the last few pics) is a "Jungle", because it does not have a complete stripe, and "wavy" designs. The second one is an Aptor.

I see alot of misnaming patterns, but it is usually the between Aptor, and Reverse Stripe. Very incomplete "Reverse Stripes" though they may still look alot like Reverse Stripes, are "Patternless Striped" IMO. The problem with the Patternless Stripe/Aptor pattern, is very few of them are actually without some pattern. So you see the reverse stripe-type APTORS, for sale as Reverse Stripes. They look alot like, the ones I am posting. There is a non-Albino, non-Reverse Stripe, and an "Aptor", who both have pretty much the same type of pattern. Both hatched with only 3 or 4 dots down the center of their backs, nearly "Patternless". Does it make one a Reverse Stripe and the other an Aptor? I do not think so, myself. I have some more I`ll post too.

I would describe "Patternless Stripe" as an "aberrant" Stripe or Reverse Stripe, in some cases. They hatch, all different, and even some that hatch as Reverse Stripes, will fade away into the dotted-dashed type pattern, that you see on the last gecko you posted. It looks alot like a Stripe, but has a few "dots" toward the center also. That is what I mean by aberrant. "Real" reverse stripes would have a single solid line, not a broken one. Those are called "incomplete" reverse stripes, and I think is what some Aptors are also.

I have had them hatch as fairly "normal" looking stripes or reverse stripes, and "turn into" a PRS as they grow, and I`ve had others hatch Patternless Striped, and later turn into a very spotted animal. It can be fun to watch them change! I think it has maybe confused some of us though.

 

[Retribution Reptiles]

So Mr. Letkey,

would you say that a Patternless stripe is the same as a hypo stripe? From my understanding there are some people that have crossed BS and reverse stripe and had a patty stripe. or am i possibly misunderstanding? I know that there was a Dom hypo gene back in the day called the ghost. But i thought that was more phased out to a more line bred hypo trait.

i could be totally wrong in my understanding.

 

[Gregg M]

I think Jeremys stripe post is the most complete and correct one I have seen to date... That would be the one to go by in my opinion...

Ryan, most, if not all hypos in the hobby can be traced back to one common hypo line... That would be the Hine line hypos...

 

[herpencounter]

The second gecko I would not consider a APTOR if you could see her in person you would agree. lol!

I have to agree with you that your second gecko is lacking enough pattern to say its an APTOR (IMO).

Baby stripes and baby reverse stripes are very easy to tell apart, but as they get older it can be harder and harder, so what I think people are doing is selling the geckos as what they looked like when they hatched. That is why I am seeing reverse stripes as stripes.

Also… I purchased the first one as a reverse stripe and second as a stripe.

 

[Retribution Reptiles]

maybe changing breeders? If i was unsure in the slightest there are at least 5 people that i can call or PM on here with out any hesitation and know they are willing to help me. those are just 5 people that i can think of. I know there are many more the that.

 

[GroovyGeckos.com]

Thats the thing, most of them do not lack enough pattern, for most to consider them "Aptors". Yours does look alot like a stripe, but it also has reverse stripe type markings, making it an "Aptor" IMO. The two geckos I posted have similar patterns to the second one you posted. That is clearly the "Aberrant Stripe" I am talking about. There is alot of "patterning" but it can not easily be classified, is what I mean. I have a lot of experience with the Aptor patterning trait, having been one of the people that created the first "Patternless Stripes". That is how we stumbled upon the "secrets" behind the whole Aptor/Eclipse project. There are just some that barely fit into any category. Its not a stripe, its not a reverse stripe, its just like a jumbled mass of spots, on some. lol Your gecko certainly does remind me of some of the "wierder" ones I`ve hatched. So that is why I say that.

Both of the geckos I posted, have nearly the same pattern on them. The only difference is one is an Albino. They are both "Patternless Striped" though. :main_yes: Alot of them(Aptors/Patternless Stripes) take influence from both the striped and reverse stripe patterns.

I wish I could post more pictures right now, but am at my limit. I have some more Aptor comparisons, with their non-Albino counterparts, sharing nearly identical patterns. The non-Albino ones look like Reverse Stripes to most people, and the Aptors, are obviously Aptors. So you would be able to see what I mean when I say both are "Patternless Striped", even though the non-Albino one looks much more like a reverse stripe. It is only so, because of the black pigment, you would not see, on the Albino version. :main_robin:

 

[Jeremy Letkey]

So Mr. Letkey,

would you say that a Patternless stripe is the same as a hypo stripe? From my understanding there are some people that have crossed BS and reverse stripe and had a patty stripe. or am i possibly misunderstanding? I know that there was a Dom hypo gene back in the day called the ghost. But i thought that was more phased out to a more line bred hypo trait.

i could be totally wrong in my understanding.

This is the only thing that I am going to address for now. I will get to the other stripe issues later.

Hypo stripe and patternless stripe are to completely different types of animal, with a similar look. How can they look the same and yet be different, well it's in the genetics.

A hypo stripe is a combination of a hypo or super hypo animals and striped animals. The resulting offspring will generally have a hypo or super hypo body and yet have a striped tail.

A patternless stripe is the result of breeding a striped animal to a reverse striped animal. Resulting offspring generally have a hypo or super hypo body and a striped tail.

There are also many other possible outcomes from both of these crosses.



The ghost trait is a whole seperate issue. It really does not have anything to do with the stripe trait.
Ghost is a Dominate trait in my opinion and is still alive and well in some collections. lol