Yay for misrepresentation...

[Herpluver]

A few months ago I purchased a few groups of females from Fauna that were, shall we say, misrepresented? One grouping were supposed to be virgins, while the other group were supposed to be het free. The virgins produced most of the babies I've hatched this year, and the supposed het free's produced me albinos, when they weren't albino themselves.

While I do not wish to muddy the gene pool's, i VEHEMENTLY REFUSE to cull ANY animal, for ANY purpose aside from it being severely deformed to the point of having a severe quality of life deficit. If I was to ever sell them it would only be as Pet Quality with the disclaimer that I do not know the full parentage. I will be testing out the genes from some of these females over the next few years to see if a few suspicions are correct.. But as for now I thought I'd come here to see if I could get some insight from the more knowledgeable community.

This little on e I believe is a Black Hole. It's eyes are completely black from what I can tell, but getting a pic of this little ones eyes is nearly impossible with how much it loves to move about! LOL

Here is one of the first pics





I have others I'd like to post, but first we'll see how the forum members respond to this post.

For those of you that decide to flame me or my lovely little babies, your energy would be better spent talking to a brick wall.

For those who are interested in helping a fellow out, I say Thank You So Much!!

Thanks in advance for any and all assistance!

 

[Kristi23]

Can you get a pic with the nose? Many Mack enigmas have solid eyes.

 

[DrCarrotTail]

I agree the little buy looks like a Mack enigma. full body pictures and pictures of the parents would help. Cute little one! Will definitely make someone an awesome pet

 

[telliott4]

Het free. Is free a morph? I haven't heard of it, is it an acronym?

 

[Dreamsong]

Het free. Is free a morph? I haven't heard of it, is it an acronym?

I'm fairly certain that it means they would be het for no morphs, other than normal. If that's what they were sold as, I'd sooner say you lucked out. Can't wait to see what other pretty little hatchies you get from these females!

 

[Herpluver]

Here is the nose shot


And here is his current pattern! One of my fav's at the moment



And yes, Dream was right.. I meant that they were supposed to be het for nothing, no hidden anything.

I will get pics of the Momma up shortly

EDIT: It's name is 6 by the way. As it had those 6 dots on its back, and conveniently was also the 6th hatchling of 2013!

 

[Herpluver]

Ok, here is the Mommy




She was sold to me as a TUG Snow. I purchased her with a Patternless Mack Snow Rainwater Albino female and a Mack Snow Enigma male

This is the male



Now, I only bred the male to my Mack Snow female and my Tangerine Enigma. The girl told me they were a proven breeder group, and as I have yet to get her to respond yet via email I am going to assume she bred them together. She also dropped these 2 babies later on.



EDIT: Ok Strange! I tried to remove those attached images, but it wouldnt let me. They shouldve been two babies and not the male again. Blah

EDIT 2: Fixed it

 

[Kristi23]

No eclipse there. Snow enigma.

 

[stager]

agree no eclipse there

 

[Herpluver]

Either way its a little cutie and super hand tolerant! Could you help me better define why there is no Eclipse? On the leo wiki it says that the Eclipse gene manifests via solid black eyes. Am I really that blind or aren't his eyes completely black?

I am not trying to be rude, just trying to be better educated is all.

Thanks for your responses

 

[DrCarrotTail]

Super snows also have solid black eyes. With or without the eclipse gene they look the same. Since you got a super snow from the pairing the female has to be snow and the male does look like a super snow enigma. Is that an albino in the first picture of the babies?

Whether they're what you wanted or not your male and female look really cool

 

[Herpluver]

So then the first baby I posted with the polka dots is a super snow enigma? or just a mack snow enigma? Thats why I was wondering about the eclipse gene. It kind of confused me.

Oh I just wanted healthy babies, IDC what they are tbh! My only concern was, when/if I sell these guys, how do I represent the genetics if I'm quite unsure myself? I love each and every one of my reptiles like they are my own children, so they could all be normals and I'd find some reason to call them unique!

My only other thing was wondering what exactly they were.

Yes that is an Albino, what looks to be patternless also. I've still got quite a few other babies to post some pics of, they are all gorgeous little babies!

 

[stager]

Eclipse's will usually have white feet and nose. And I'm not flaming but are you breeding mack snow to tug snow, or am I reading it wrong.? That is mudding the waters because you wil never be able to tell which snow it is. But it is a cute baby looks mack enigma to me.

 

[Herpluver]

She was not bred here. Her intended was my SHTCTB Het Tremper male, till she started dropping eggs out of nowhere.. The previous owner had bred her to the Mack Snow Enigma male. Trust me when I say I want to be part of the reason the lines stay PURE! My idol in this biz is Matt from SaSobek. I will do everything I can to emulate his quality and style. As well as try and only produce pure lines of snows, eye pigments and albinos. I truly appreciate your concern.

 

[katie_]

Nice hatchlings either way

 

[stager]

She was not bred here. Her intended was my SHTCTB Het Tremper male, till she started dropping eggs out of nowhere.. The previous owner had bred her to the Mack Snow Enigma male. Trust me when I say I want to be part of the reason the lines stay PURE! My idol in this biz is Matt from SaSobek. I will do everything I can to emulate his quality and style. As well as try and only produce pure lines of snows, eye pigments and albinos. I truly appreciate your concern.

Oh sorry just re read your post.

 

[Matthew David]

It's a Mack enigma and a lovely one too anyway regarding tug haven't you heard about how tainted allegedly tugs own snows are ? People are getting standard Mack's from them lately indicating poor genetics ... It's gotten them a bad name lately over it.

 

[Herpluver]

I didn't buy them directly from The Urban Gecko. I actually received them from a third party who supposedly bought them directly from The Urban Gecko. The thing is, they are both apparently het albino... but they weren't advertised to me as het anything

 

[Matthew David]

You can prove that out if it means being sure - TUG is not in good shape just now personally I have found alot of their stock to be tainted or to have hets that werent mentioned

 

[Herpluver]

That's a shame I have some gorgeous babies from my male and female though, so that's the silver lining to the cloud. I have a female that is 100% het bell, a male that is 100% het tremper and another female that is homozygous Rainwater. So I at least have the capability to prove out which is which. Now for the exciting journey of proving them all out!