ReptileMan27
New Member
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- 2,409
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- New York
VERY IMPORTANT, ALL BOA & PYTHON KEEPERS PLEASE READ
- Thread starter ReptileMan27
- Start date
KelliH
New Member
- Messages
- 6,638
- Location
- Fort Worth, TX
This is an extremely grave proposal. My husband and I will be writing letters, making calls, sending emails, whatever needs to be done to stop this.
T&KBrouse
K, the Crazy Snake Lady
- Messages
- 1,560
Here's the direct link to what was in the Federal Register:
http://www.fws.gov/policy/library/E8-1770.pdf
This needs everyone's attention NOW! Notice it says no email. Please get your courteous letters out, guys, and encourage everyone to do the same.
http://www.fws.gov/policy/library/E8-1770.pdf
This needs everyone's attention NOW! Notice it says no email. Please get your courteous letters out, guys, and encourage everyone to do the same.
PrototypeGeckos
New Member
- Messages
- 1,354
- Location
- McDonough, Ga
I just don't see how they can do this, I know they CAN, but why, I have no idea. I see why they would want to get the big boys, Retics, Burms and Anacondas out of captivity, but still don't think that is right, I think that is our choice, and there is nothing wrong with having a huge snake if you know how big it is up front, and don't decide to let it go in the woods somewhere when it gets 10' or 12' long. I will be doing whatever it takes to help get this stopped, I don't see how something like this can pass, but still I am not going to sit back and trust my instincts, I am going to fight it anyway possible, and I encourage everyone, even non-snake owners to do the same, because if this passes, what is next? Geckos, Chameleons, could be anything, whatever they want to do.
Ccrashca069
New Member
- Messages
- 3,179
- Location
- Lake Berryessa/Napa, Calif
My best friend Joe who also has a Reptile Rescue is writting letters and putting the word out on myspace also. I don't own any snakes but its not right. Like Shaun stated what is next?
T&KBrouse
K, the Crazy Snake Lady
- Messages
- 1,560
This post just came in from Mr. Jeff Ronne aka; The Boaphile.
Figured I would pass it on.
~~~~
Join PIJAC right now!!!
We all must make a contribution to this cause right now. This change in the law will take some time, but the time for action to curb this is right now. The form posted by Fish and Wildlife is essentially an inquiry for information. A request that they are required to do before attempting to pass legislation that they would like to pass. An opportunity for interested parties to send information in the form they require. This specific requirement gives the opportunity and excuse to just ignore anything sent outside of their guidelines. So the form they have set up must be followed. My belief, after further reading and thought, is that PIJAC will step up and take this bull by the horns using communication they know is effective. They may actually make suggestions in addition that we can follow. I believe they will have a plan for each of us to follow very soon. Probably something will be available this coming week from PIJAC.
But first and foremost...
You must join PIJAC right now if you have not already. PIJAC requires dues based upon the dollar volume of your business. The amount is very small. The amount for the membership is .04%. For a business that does $1,000,000 in sales, that would be $400.00. Very little in the grand scheme of things. Now, many of you have not actually made any money yet. That or you have not made much money at all. So my own personal suggestion is that you sign up for a membership, NOW, and that you sign up for enough that you are going to make a difference. PIJAC is not funded by a group of hugely wealthy philanthropists that pour their cash into this defender of our hobby/business. PIJAC is a political action committee that is funded by dues. That's it. The lobbyists and or experts that testify and work on our behalf, are paid out of the dollars we give. Our hobby is under assault and without a good defense, we could loose the right to own these creatures we all love. I would like to suggest that at least a payment of $50 accompany your membership application no matter if your business pulls in $125,000 in sales or not. The vast majority, I'm sure don't do that kind of dollar volume. However, we are going to be helping to fund this organization that will need dollars to get the job done.
Here is the link:
http://pijac.org/i4a/pages/index.cfm?pageid=90
Or copy and paste this link:
https://pijac.org/i4a/forms/form.cfm?id=8
Join now if you are not already a member.
Jeff Ronne Sr.
The Boaphile__________________
Figured I would pass it on.
~~~~
Join PIJAC right now!!!
We all must make a contribution to this cause right now. This change in the law will take some time, but the time for action to curb this is right now. The form posted by Fish and Wildlife is essentially an inquiry for information. A request that they are required to do before attempting to pass legislation that they would like to pass. An opportunity for interested parties to send information in the form they require. This specific requirement gives the opportunity and excuse to just ignore anything sent outside of their guidelines. So the form they have set up must be followed. My belief, after further reading and thought, is that PIJAC will step up and take this bull by the horns using communication they know is effective. They may actually make suggestions in addition that we can follow. I believe they will have a plan for each of us to follow very soon. Probably something will be available this coming week from PIJAC.
But first and foremost...
You must join PIJAC right now if you have not already. PIJAC requires dues based upon the dollar volume of your business. The amount is very small. The amount for the membership is .04%. For a business that does $1,000,000 in sales, that would be $400.00. Very little in the grand scheme of things. Now, many of you have not actually made any money yet. That or you have not made much money at all. So my own personal suggestion is that you sign up for a membership, NOW, and that you sign up for enough that you are going to make a difference. PIJAC is not funded by a group of hugely wealthy philanthropists that pour their cash into this defender of our hobby/business. PIJAC is a political action committee that is funded by dues. That's it. The lobbyists and or experts that testify and work on our behalf, are paid out of the dollars we give. Our hobby is under assault and without a good defense, we could loose the right to own these creatures we all love. I would like to suggest that at least a payment of $50 accompany your membership application no matter if your business pulls in $125,000 in sales or not. The vast majority, I'm sure don't do that kind of dollar volume. However, we are going to be helping to fund this organization that will need dollars to get the job done.
Here is the link:
http://pijac.org/i4a/pages/index.cfm?pageid=90
Or copy and paste this link:
https://pijac.org/i4a/forms/form.cfm?id=8
Join now if you are not already a member.
Jeff Ronne Sr.
The Boaphile__________________
Last edited:
N
Nigel4less
Guest
This is an absolutely disgusting proposal, I keep various Boas. I honestly can't imagine my home without them. We need to spread the word ASAP, if we don't speak up for these animals who will?
dmward
Big Dumb Bear
- Messages
- 65
- Location
- Woodbridge, VA
This was my Comment:
Mr. Assitant Secretary,
This is a comment in OPPOSITION of the proposed listing of pythons and boas on the injurious species list.
These animals represent a very large portion of the reptile pet industry. There are countless numbers of private breeders that this is their sole business.
By adding Pythons & Boas to the injurious species list FWS will be effectively closing countless small businesses. At these time of economic strain we do not think this will be view favorably by any one.
To address some of the specific questions listed in Federal Register notice:
It would be very difficult to assess the total number of animals avaialbale for sale wholesale or retail due to the heart of this industry is not huge companies, it is driven by small business people that have breeding operations of small numbers of animals each year.
As to the eradication of these species it would be next to impossible since there are so many thousands of animals owned by responsible citizens and responsible caring breeders that it would take many thousands of FTEs of an agency that is already by their own admittance spread to thin to regulate the already burdensome policies.
We will be urging everyone in the reptile keeper community to contact their Senate and House of Representatives to speak out against this and to make it very clear to them that this proposed rule making will be damagin not only to our hobby and personal interests, but will be a huge blow to small business owners that breed these animals and those that manufacture supplies to support them and the hobbyist such as caging, feeding, veterinarians, and show organizer.
Mr. Laverty, I sincerely hope that you will reconsider this proposed listing of Pythons & Boas to the Injurious species list.
The few instances of these animals being found in the wild of the Everglades is but a tiny tiny fraction that are completely non-representative of the community or keeper and breeders of these fantastic creatuires.
Sincerely,
D. Ward
I am also Including a link to your the representatives contacts so that this can be elevated to people that will listen to Constituency.
http://www.congress.org/congressorg/directory/congdir.tt
Mr. Assitant Secretary,
This is a comment in OPPOSITION of the proposed listing of pythons and boas on the injurious species list.
These animals represent a very large portion of the reptile pet industry. There are countless numbers of private breeders that this is their sole business.
By adding Pythons & Boas to the injurious species list FWS will be effectively closing countless small businesses. At these time of economic strain we do not think this will be view favorably by any one.
To address some of the specific questions listed in Federal Register notice:
It would be very difficult to assess the total number of animals avaialbale for sale wholesale or retail due to the heart of this industry is not huge companies, it is driven by small business people that have breeding operations of small numbers of animals each year.
As to the eradication of these species it would be next to impossible since there are so many thousands of animals owned by responsible citizens and responsible caring breeders that it would take many thousands of FTEs of an agency that is already by their own admittance spread to thin to regulate the already burdensome policies.
We will be urging everyone in the reptile keeper community to contact their Senate and House of Representatives to speak out against this and to make it very clear to them that this proposed rule making will be damagin not only to our hobby and personal interests, but will be a huge blow to small business owners that breed these animals and those that manufacture supplies to support them and the hobbyist such as caging, feeding, veterinarians, and show organizer.
Mr. Laverty, I sincerely hope that you will reconsider this proposed listing of Pythons & Boas to the Injurious species list.
The few instances of these animals being found in the wild of the Everglades is but a tiny tiny fraction that are completely non-representative of the community or keeper and breeders of these fantastic creatuires.
Sincerely,
D. Ward
I am also Including a link to your the representatives contacts so that this can be elevated to people that will listen to Constituency.
http://www.congress.org/congressorg/directory/congdir.tt
T&KBrouse
K, the Crazy Snake Lady
- Messages
- 1,560
Doug,
That sounds wonderful. I've been fumbling with words all weekend trying to write something that will make a difference.
Thanks for setting a template for me to go by.
K
That sounds wonderful. I've been fumbling with words all weekend trying to write something that will make a difference.
Thanks for setting a template for me to go by.
K
dmward
Big Dumb Bear
- Messages
- 65
- Location
- Woodbridge, VA
Thanks,
I work in the federal government world in DC and do a fair amount of policy / technical writing. So this was up my alley.
There are two important things here 1) leave a comment on regulations. gov AND contact yout senators and local congressional reps.
The congressional and senate contact is extremely important, especially for those that are breeders.
By raising a stink that this rule making with shut down small businesses in these economic times will really get their attention. It only takes one senator to call FWS and tell them to retract. Honestly one very good well thought out contact to a Senator will get things done. As soon as senators hear about Federal actions costing jobs they react.
Another thing. If you use my comment please change it enough that it is obviously not the same one. The people that review these will discard any that are too similar that can be miscontrued as "form letters"
Only unique individual comments are considered. In this electronic age it is too easy to stuff the comment box with form letters that are meaningless.
I work in the federal government world in DC and do a fair amount of policy / technical writing. So this was up my alley.
There are two important things here 1) leave a comment on regulations. gov AND contact yout senators and local congressional reps.
The congressional and senate contact is extremely important, especially for those that are breeders.
By raising a stink that this rule making with shut down small businesses in these economic times will really get their attention. It only takes one senator to call FWS and tell them to retract. Honestly one very good well thought out contact to a Senator will get things done. As soon as senators hear about Federal actions costing jobs they react.
Another thing. If you use my comment please change it enough that it is obviously not the same one. The people that review these will discard any that are too similar that can be miscontrued as "form letters"
Only unique individual comments are considered. In this electronic age it is too easy to stuff the comment box with form letters that are meaningless.
T&KBrouse
K, the Crazy Snake Lady
- Messages
- 1,560
Oh yeah, I'd use my own words, of course. I'm just not very eloquent, I guess you could say, so actually seeing how someone else words something kinda helps my own attempts. (How words flow together and such)
Don't worry. No plegerism, I promise.
K
Don't worry. No plegerism, I promise.
K
Gregg M
Registered Member
- Messages
- 3,055
- Location
- The Rotten Apple NYC
Here is what I wrote on another forum for those who seemed suprized something like this is going down...
And no one saw anything like this coming??? It was just a matter of time before the feds got involved... I do not agree with the proposed ban, but in all honesty, who do we have to blame... The law makers??? LOL... Are they the ones who let Burms, Nile monitors, and other assorted fauna go in the tropical parts of the U.S.??? Are they bringing them to the beach to show them off??? We have our very own community to blame...
When will it all end???
When the reptile keeping community on the whole becomes more responsible or until no one is allowed to keep anything anymore...
From what we are all seeing, bans will be placed and our hobby will no longer be legal... Will this stop the trade??? Not much but we may be limmited to CBB animals... However, it will be an underground operation and we will be muted...
I am sure some will do it properly and get the permits needed but most will not...
Like I said, I am not for the ban but you have to kind of understand why things are going the way they are...
And no one saw anything like this coming??? It was just a matter of time before the feds got involved... I do not agree with the proposed ban, but in all honesty, who do we have to blame... The law makers??? LOL... Are they the ones who let Burms, Nile monitors, and other assorted fauna go in the tropical parts of the U.S.??? Are they bringing them to the beach to show them off??? We have our very own community to blame...
When will it all end???
When the reptile keeping community on the whole becomes more responsible or until no one is allowed to keep anything anymore...
From what we are all seeing, bans will be placed and our hobby will no longer be legal... Will this stop the trade??? Not much but we may be limmited to CBB animals... However, it will be an underground operation and we will be muted...
I am sure some will do it properly and get the permits needed but most will not...
Like I said, I am not for the ban but you have to kind of understand why things are going the way they are...
dmward
Big Dumb Bear
- Messages
- 65
- Location
- Woodbridge, VA
I am not surprised. It does go back to our own community that is responsible for this problem. The slackers that decided they don't want their pets anymore and just let them go are the ones we need to crack down on.
But people are hard headed and, as Americans, we are free to do what we want....until there is a law against it. It sucks that some morons take advantage of a situation and lack the responsibility to keep an activity like ours self regulating.
The other problem area is the parents that get a reptile for their kids becuase they think they're cute. And then realize it's a not exactly what they expected when they get them home, they bite, they get BIG, they eat bugs and mice, they smell (sometimes), and would outlive us if taken care of properly.
Its the whole instant gratification societal norms we perpetuate and never think about the consequences. Everything is disposable to some people!
But people are hard headed and, as Americans, we are free to do what we want....until there is a law against it. It sucks that some morons take advantage of a situation and lack the responsibility to keep an activity like ours self regulating.
The other problem area is the parents that get a reptile for their kids becuase they think they're cute. And then realize it's a not exactly what they expected when they get them home, they bite, they get BIG, they eat bugs and mice, they smell (sometimes), and would outlive us if taken care of properly.
Its the whole instant gratification societal norms we perpetuate and never think about the consequences. Everything is disposable to some people!
T&KBrouse
K, the Crazy Snake Lady
- Messages
- 1,560
As for Florida, the little known truth about our "wild" burms here is that Hurricane Andrew seriously damaged the Miami Zoo. Animals escaped due to enclosure damage. The Glades had a problem with monkeys after that storm. Well, the burms took care of that. A recent study done found that almost all the burms that were caught were genetically related. Not saying that no one is setting theirs free, 'cause they are, but alot of the population came from the zoo.
And there goes my phone again!!! Sheesh! What the heck??
Hopefully I can finish this thought in a bit...
sry
And there goes my phone again!!! Sheesh! What the heck??
Hopefully I can finish this thought in a bit...
sry
dmward
Big Dumb Bear
- Messages
- 65
- Location
- Woodbridge, VA
Interesting......Zoo escapees.....never even crossed my mind.
T&KBrouse
K, the Crazy Snake Lady
- Messages
- 1,560
Anyways, (before the phone rings again)...
The point was, since the hurricane, there has a issue with big snakes in the Glades, owners releasing theirs has just exacerbated the problem.
On the local news today, they've reported a 13 foot retic was found in someones backyard in Manatee County... *sigh*:main_no:
Every time this happens our animals are one step closer to being snatched away.
The point was, since the hurricane, there has a issue with big snakes in the Glades, owners releasing theirs has just exacerbated the problem.
On the local news today, they've reported a 13 foot retic was found in someones backyard in Manatee County... *sigh*:main_no:
Every time this happens our animals are one step closer to being snatched away.
ReptileMan27
New Member
- Messages
- 2,409
- Location
- New York
Please sign this
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/boasandpythonsban/
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/boasandpythonsban/
Yeah, it's not looking good for the big ones, especially in Florida. However, even if you don't think people should be able to have the large or venomous snakes, it's time for all of us to do something about it. For the average person (or lawmaker) there is little difference between a 15+ ft burm and a ball python.
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