Would You consider leos domesticated?

[spykerherps]

In all scenes of the definition I believe they have been.
Say at the very lest more domesticated then a Cave Gecko.

 

[canadiangecko]

yeah probably with all these morphs but like all pets their is going to be one or two exceptions

 

[moosassah]

yeah probably with all these morphs but like all pets their is going to be one or two exceptions

like blizzards?

 

[herpencounter]

I would say they are for the most part...

 

[Gregg M]

Leos are pretty far from domesticated... Wild animals such as reptiles will never become domesticated...
The thing is reptiles are so basic and instinctive they will never become dependant enough on use where they would lose the ability to live in the wild...
With all the generations bred in captivity if we were to release one into the wild it would revert right back to its natural state... Leos only need us to survive in captivity...

Captive breeding alone does not constitute domestication... There is much more to it than that...

 

[snared99]

I think you guys sit there and think " Hmmm what thread can I get Gregg going in now?' Lol

And no i do not think they are domesticated, unfortunetly they are not blessed with alot of brain power. I do beleive they learn routines very well, for their basic needs.

 

[Gregg M]

Pat, from now on, I give my opinion on a subject... I will no longer be beating the dead horse... LOL

 

[LeapinLizards]

I think you guys sit there and think " Hmmm what thread can I get Gregg going in now?' Lol

Haha! I thought the exact same thing...

 

[Retribution Reptiles]

Plain and simple, geckos and other reptiles have been conditioned. They are like some people in the world not a whole lot of brain power but can be conditioned to do what we need to do.

Kidding about the people thing. Not kidding about the reptiles.

 

[lizardlove]

I'm not sure reptiles are quite bright enough to be domesticated, persay, but they have the ability to learn that their human keepers are no threat to them. If that is what constitutes domestication, sure, but it's not White Fang or anything.

 

[Sunrise Reptile]

Pat, from now on, I give my opinion on a subject... I will no longer be beating the dead horse... LOL

:main_thumbsup: Right On, Brutha!!!

 

[BettaDragon]

If I'm right, for something to be domesticated it can't survive without humans, correct? Or am I totally wrong?

 

[lizardlove]

If I'm right, for something to be domesticated it can't survive without humans, correct? Or am I totally wrong?

That's what I thought. And leos can definitely do without us, unless it's weak or something, but that's different, it has to do with illness or genetics or whatever, not domesticity. So they're not domesticated, just very patient. :main_laugh:

 

[herpencounter]

Well if I could edit what I said I would.
After thinking about it either something is domesticated or its NOT! No in-between... So IMO Leopard geckos are NOT domesticated.

domesticated
1. to convert (animals, plants, etc.) to domestic uses; tame.
2. to tame (an animal), esp. by generations of breeding, to live in close association with human beings as a pet or work animal and usually creating a dependency so that the animal loses its ability to live in the wild.

The only reason they depend on us is because we keep them in a cage that they cant get out of.
I can see some on saying “Hey! Leopard geckos depend on us.” for you people read above LOL.

 

[BettaDragon]

Yeah that's what I thought. I'm pretty sure if something's domesticated it can't live in the wild (example: corn or cows). I was kinda second guessing myself a bit though because cats can be feral and some breeds of dogs can live without people.

 

[spykerherps]

I was on the fence about this and understand that reptiles brains are quit different then mammal brains. but many of the definitions fit almost perfectly.

when I was creating this thread I was going to do a poll when I got to the poll I decided I didn't want to do the thread but it was too late it had already created the thread without the poll . So I figured lets let it ride and see what happens.

The thing is reptiles are so basic and instinctive they will never become dependant enough on use where they would lose the ability to live in the wild...
With all the generations bred in captivity if we were to release one into the wild it would revert right back to its natural state... Leos only need us to survive in captivity...

Captive breeding alone does not constitute domestication... There is much more to it than that...

I agree with most of that statement... but leopard Geckos may be the exception
I think 98% of the morphs we have created would die in the wild because we have changed their natural colors and feeding behaviors don't think they will find a bowl full of mealworms just sittin around in the wild and yes their hunting instincts would probably kick in for most. if they were to survive, conditions would have to be ideal I am sure some normals or maybe even some high yellows would be able to do it but all the albinos the tangs the blizzards, enigmas would not make it fair. perhaps they would survive with no predictors around.

Some breeds of dog and house cats can revert back to being feral and we still consider them domesticated
interesting read and leopard geckos are mentioned
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_domesticated_animals

my conclusion is that they are semi-domesticated IMO

Thanks for the civil debate ALL

 

[combadao]

I do not believe in a clear cut definition of "domesticated animal", in terms of achieved results on the animal behavior (like the need for them to like humans). I have seen several definitions, some more scientific than others. So, the main point is that the definition is not always the same.

Perhaps you should define the definition that you want to use.

What I think is that the essential thinking on domestication is the use of an animal to some human activities and by doing that also controlling or altering its normal life. At the same time it must have a close contact to humans (after all domestication comes from domesticus, latin for belonging to the house).

In the old times, domestication had a purpose mainly driven by aiding the survival of the human population. Nowadays the human activity is recreational (in this case), but human nonetheless. So domestication also evolves, but it is always connected to human household.

Leos, can be a very good species to domestication because:

-it is easy to feed them
-they can be bred in captivity
-calm disposition and unlikely to serious harm a person
-manageable size

The only big difference I see, when compared with some mammals is the impossibility of the human to enter their social hierarchy, and even if humans could do this there would not be any benefit of that, as in mammals.

I have no doubt that in the next generations we will see the average leo changing shape and behavior so that they are more attractive to humans. Selective breeding, new mutations and selecting through a pool of genetic diversity go a long way and they do not serve only to create morphs, but to change animals to more "appropriate" pets.

But i do not believe this will happen to all reptiles in captivity, perhaps only to leos (and some more?).

Nonetheless, if leos are not domesticated, they are in the process.

Just a note, cats, dogs, cows, horses... can live in the wild. Perhaps with more difficulty or with less, depending on the wild that we are talking about.