Az. bark scorpion babies (Centruroides sculpturatus)

[SFgeckos]

30+ babies of Centruroides sculpturatus from the other week! Spent some time trying to seperate them into groups. Photos are with and without blacklight.

-Jon

 

[robin]

jon, i can't say i like them. the things scare the poo outa me but as long as you enjoy them, cool.

 

[Enigmatic_Reptiles]

Those look great. My wife refuses to let me work with inverts now-a-days

 

[leoman777]

awesome! congrats on the little buggers i love watching scorpions hunt

 

[SFgeckos]

Haha Robin! Yea, some species I only have for research purposes like hot reptiles, black widows, various scorpions etc. Az barks are the most venomous species in North America! There used to be an anti-venom available but it was pulled off the market a few years ago.

Jon

 

[robin]

Haha Robin! Yea, some species I only have for research purposes like hot reptiles, black widows, various scorpions etc. Az barks are the most venomous species in North America! There used to be an anti-venom available but it was pulled off the market a few years ago.

Jon

i once lived in a house way in the country that was loaded with whatever species is in texas, i think they are a bark scorpion too. i had enough stings from those buggers. you had to check your shoes, all your cloths, around the sinks and such :-/

 

[Sunrise Reptile]

Most likely Centruroides vittatus, aka Striped Bark Scorpion, Robin. I do believe they're the most common species in TX.

Nice scorps, Jon! :main_yes:

 

[SFgeckos]

Maurice is probably correct, C. vittatus is extremely common throughout its range in TX.

"i had enough stings from those buggers. you had to check your shoes, all your cloths, around the sinks and such"

Ouch! Well with Az barks you DEFINITELY don't want to get stung, there are actually recorded fatalities in Az and 100+ people still die in Mexico yearly. I have no problems handling my beadeds or gilas, but I never ever touch my Az bark scorpions!

J

 

[thegeckoguy23]

awesome congrats

 

[Gregg M]

Hey Jon, I thought they did away with C. sculpturatus and grouped them into C. exilicauda...

Also, I belive that C. vittatus has a the more toxic sting if I am not mistaken... I read a study about it somewhere...

Anyway, deaths from either species are not directly from their venom... It is reported that the huge majority of deaths is actually due to anaphylactic shock and not the actual venom... This is why they have done away with the antivenin altogether... The lack of good medical attention in Mexico would explain why so many people die as a result of their sting there...

Having been stung numerous times by both species, I can tell you the stings are not that bad... The worst sting I have ever got was from Parabuthus transvalicus... Very painful and the effects lasted a couple of days... No sickness or vomiting though... Just pain...

Both AZ barks and Texas barks make really great captives and are very prolific...

 

[SFgeckos]

"Anyway, deaths from either species are not directly from their venom... It is reported that the huge majority of deaths is actually due to anaphylactic shock and not the actual venom... This is why they have done away with the antivenin altogether... The lack of good medical attention in Mexico would explain why so many people die as a result of their sting there...
Having been stung numerous times by both species, I can tell you the stings are not that bad... The worst sting I have ever got was from Parabuthus transvalicus... Very painful and the effects lasted a couple of days... No sickness or vomiting though... Just pain...
Both AZ barks and Texas barks make really great captives and are very prolific..."

Agreed Gregg! Personally, I'ld rather not take any chances to test myself, "just in case" I have some type of hypersensitivity 1 reaction and go into anaphylactic shock! Some of the sources I used include: Biology of Scorpion (Polis 1990), Venomous and poisonous animals (Habermehl, 1981), Merck Manual, and a medical entomology book which all consider Az barks "dangerous".

You're correct, they did combine the Az barks with the Baja California barks in the 1980's. What I found interesting about that, was 1. they have been recently proven to be genetically DNA different and 2. the venom toxicity is also very different (Baja CA barks are considered harmless, Az barks are considered "dangerous"). I'm sure in the near future, their nomenclature will be changed again!

I know a toxicologist and his concern is that some people who handle the harmless Baja CA barks, will also do the same with Az barks- since it's so difficult to tell them apart they are treating a potentially dangerous species like a harmless species. It's like an inexperienced hot keeper free handling false watercobras and then not knowing any better, free handling a king cobra like it was harmless. (bad comparison? but you get the idea)

-Jon

 

[Sunrise Reptile]

Man, why don't we hand out loaded guns to kids? I mean, the best thing to do is to not get stung, and not to brag about how many times you have been. I really hate to think how many young kids out there may end up reading a post like that.

Here's a fact. Centruroides exilicauda, also referred to as Centruroides sculpturatus, is the ONLY native scorpion species responsible for sting-related deaths in the United States. To say the venom of C. vittatus is more medically significant than that of C. exilicauda is not consistant with any of the research studies I've ever read. So if you can provide a link, I'd really like to see the publication you're referring to. I feel confident in saying that it probably doesn't exist.

One more thing. It is true that the deaths related to C. exilicauda envenomation were due to an alergic reaction to the venom. But how are you going to know if you're alergic to the venom before you're stung? Why even take the chance? I'm happy to say that, in 19 years of keepping pretty much every commonly available scorpion species as well as many not so easy to obtain species, I've received one sting. And that was from P. imperator, which we all know isn't responsible for a single death since the dawn of time worldwide.

Be safe and respect the venom! The only smart handling is safe handling! :main_yes:

 

[SFgeckos]

"Man, why don't we hand out loaded guns to kids? I mean, the best thing to do is to not get stung, and not to brag about how many times you have been. I really hate to think how many young kids out there may end up reading a post like that."

Great point, I'm sure Gregg knows that and his intention was not to "brag" about accidents but just share his personal experiences (that his immune system may be far superior to mine haha). I've had discussions with Gregg on forums for years now so I know he's an intelligent guy, he may also take direct offense to the presentation of your posting. I chose a "less subtle" way of making my point.

I've been involved in both medical and biomedical fields, so I can say from experience that allergic reactions can be extremely unpredictable and scary. I've seen people without a history of previous reactions go into shock after receiving a wasp sting, ingesting peanuts, or a child going agonal during an asthma attack. In two out of those three mentioned cases, even with the best medical care, sadly the human succumbed to the condition.

"Be safe and respect the venom! The only smart handling is safe handling!"
I agree 100%!!!

Jon

 

[Sunrise Reptile]

The truth is sometimes best presented without a "sugar coating". It's not my intent to offend anyone, but some of those comments just didn't sit well with me. This is a forum after all, and you just don't always know who's reading.

As far as your other statements, I couldn't agree more! :main_thumbsup:

"Man, why don't we hand out loaded guns to kids? I mean, the best thing to do is to not get stung, and not to brag about how many times you have been. I really hate to think how many young kids out there may end up reading a post like that."

Great point, I'm sure Gregg knows that and his intention was not to "brag" about accidents but just share his personal experiences (that his immune system may be far superior to mine haha). I've had discussions with Gregg on forums for years now so I know he's an intelligent guy, he may also take direct offense to the presentation of your posting. I chose a "less subtle" way of making my point.

I've been involved in both medical and biomedical fields, so I can say from experience that allergic reactions can be extremely unpredictable and scary. I've seen people without a history of previous reactions go into shock after receiving a wasp sting, ingesting peanuts, or a child going agonal during an asthma attack. In two out of those three mentioned cases, even with the best medical care, sadly the human succumbed to the condition.

"Be safe and respect the venom! The only smart handling is safe handling!"
I agree 100%!!!

Jon

 

[Gregg M]

Man, why don't we hand out loaded guns to kids? I mean, the best thing to do is to not get stung, and not to brag about how many times you have been. I really hate to think how many young kids out there may end up reading a post like that.

Well, kids should not have loaded guns and they should not have pet scorpions like Centrutoides... Not bragging... Just saying the stings are not really that bad... Truth be told bees have killed way more people in the US than C. exilicauda... Should we tell people to stay indoors because they might come across a bee and be alergic to its sting??? There is a reason why they stopped producing the antivenin for this species... It is because the venom is not deadly...

Here's a fact. Centruroides exilicauda, also referred to as Centruroides sculpturatus, is the ONLY native scorpion species responsible for sting-related deaths in the United States.

This is where your facts are clouded... C, vittatus has also caused fatalities as well as C. gracilis... Again, due to alergic reaction, not venom...

To say the venom of C. vittatus is more medically significant than that of C. exilicauda is not consistant with any of the research studies I've ever read. So if you can provide a link, I'd really like to see the publication you're referring to. I feel confident in saying that it probably doesn't exist.

Like I said, that is what I have read... If I find the info I will post it... I do not make stuff up so if I say I read it, I did...

One more thing. It is true that the deaths related to C. exilicauda envenomation were due to an alergic reaction to the venom. But how are you going to know if you're alergic to the venom before you're stung? Why even take the chance?

How do you know you are alergic??? You are a "smart" guy... You should know that you can not be alergic to a sting unless your body has already been introduced to that venom... If you are stung for the first time, you will not have an alergic reaction... So you can not be aleric to the venom before you are stung...

Why take what chance??? Why take the chance of getting stung by a sublethal scorpion that I am not alergic to??? Why eat peanut butter??? You might be alergic to that...

I admit that I made many mistakes with my scorps but I am not overly cautious when working with them...

I'm happy to say that, in 19 years of keepping pretty much every commonly available scorpion species as well as many not so easy to obtain species, I've received one sting. And that was from P. imperator, which we all know isn't responsible for a single death since the dawn of time worldwide.

I am proud of you...:main_thumbsup: Now, when you have 20 years working with animals that could actually kill you without getting envenomed, I will be super impressed..
And how do you know for sure an emperor scorpion has never caused a death??? Are you in the jungles of Africa where there are no medical facilities??? You do realize that many deaths are never reported in Africa and they generaly do not keep records when animals are involved... The fact is an emperor can kill you just as easy as a bark scorpion if you are alergic to its sting...

Be safe and respect the venom! The only smart handling is safe handling! :main_yes:

This statement, I can not argue...

What I can say that is factual is that there has not been a single death in the US due to a scorpion sting in over 20 years and this is after the antivenin has been pulled... Take what you want from thay bit of info...

 

[Sunrise Reptile]

I am proud of you...

Ask me if I care! :main_rolleyes: Ummmm ... No! I have absolutely no desire to impress you.

Show me that info on C. vittatus, or leave it out of the post.

 

[Gregg M]

Ask me if I care! :main_rolleyes: Ummmm ... No! I have absolutely no desire to impress you.

Show me that info on C. vittatus, or leave it out of the post.

I can add whatever I like to any post... I already found 3 sites that state what I said... Do your own research... Google is your friend...

 

[robin]

many times i find google info inaccurate *shrug*

 

[Gregg M]

many times i find google info inaccurate *shrug*

Google is just a search engine... It is our job to weed through the trash...:main_thumbsup:

 

[SFgeckos]

"How do you know you are alergic??? You are a "smart" guy... You should know that you can not be alergic to a sting unless your body has already been introduced to that venom... If you are stung for the first time, you will not have an alergic reaction... So you can not be aleric to the venom before you are stung...

Why take what chance??? Why take the chance of getting stung by a sublethal scorpion that I am not alergic to??? Why eat peanut butter??? You might be alergic to that...

I admit that I made many mistakes with my scorps but I am not overly cautious when working with them..."

Haha, somewhat educated yes..but smart? NO! If I was really smart, I would not have reptiles and other animals as pets! =)

True, I have heard of people eating an apple and dying because they choked on the seed! But I'ld rather not take a chance of exposing myself the first time to a foreign antigen, so that if I'm out in the field or I have an accident the next time I won't have that risk. To each his own!

Jon