let's talk diseases and parasites

[robin]

ok first off i would like to talk about diseases and parasites.

1) what parasites and diseases do you know about?

2) do you know how to prevent them?

3) do you know how to treat them?

4) do you know their life cycle?

5) do you know some of the symptoms?

i would like to discuss diseases and parasites from the most common to the more rare ones. so i would like to hear some of you guys info. no info is too little and it is ok not to know. this is where we are going to teach some of you and many of us learn.

p.s. i know we have many vet techs on here and i would love to hear from you too and i know we have our resident zookeeper around as well

 

[robin]

lets start out with some of the more heard about.

pin worms
hook worms
tape worms
flukes
amoebas
cryptosporidium
cocidia

 

[robin]

since no one want to actually participate in an intellegent coversation. here is a link to a good basic book you can get for cheap regarding reptile parasites

Understanding Reptile Parasites: A Basic Manual for Herpetoculturists & Veterinarians
http://www.amazon.com/Understanding...rpetoculturists-Herpetocultural/dp/1882770218

people ask what is wrong with my gecko and why is my gecko sick and how can i keep my gecko from getting sick and some people answer but many people fail to even do any research they just expect someone to give it to them. shoot we should start a thread on books so people can research for once

 

[Enigmatic_Reptiles]

Thats a good idea. A library or reference list of good reads.

Why dont you get that started robin haha, I can tell your itchin to create one

 

[robin]

i just rolled my eyes, travis

 

[BGalloway]

1) Just about everything you named, and also Salmonella. I found gram+ staphylococcus when I did a swabbing of my gecko's feet and poo corner for microbio lab last year.

A question though, is this JUST reptile parasites? Because if it's NOT I could go on and on about meningeal worms for hours .

Do reptiles get giardia? That's another water borne protozoan.

2) The best prevention (and this is one of my favorite sayings) is start with CLEAN HEALTHY Animals! Also, regular cleaning. Pick up poo as soon as you see it. And for goodness sakes change the water dish frequently, and don't just rinse it out, scrub it. The preceding is true for all animals.

3) Not all dewormers work on all parasites and not all antibiotics work on all bacteria, so I would look up the appropriate medication to use and seek the advice of a Knowledgeable veterinarian insofar as dosage. Oh yeah, and the best treatment is to finish the full course of antibiotics, don't stop and save the leftovers because "he's looking better".

Oh and there's a proposed treatment for crypto involving hyper-immune bovine colostrum, scientific papers on the topic detail varying levels of success (I'm pretty sure most of the papers are outdated though).

4) Again, ask me about meningeal worm and I'll go on for an hour . I know giardia and crypto, being protozoans, have a cyst stage and active stage making them really hard to kill once they're in the environment in cyst form.

5) Anorexia, weight loss, dehydration, runny feces, poor growth rate, and the ever so common JNR, just not right. These are just general symptoms for almost everything though, so nothing really diagnostic. Although most salmonella infections are sub-clinical and don't affect the reptile adversely, however this is why immunocompromised people are advised to not touch reptiles; an asymptomatic reptile may be shedding salmonella and you can guess the rest.

Um, that was all off the top of my head. So does anyone have anything to add?

 

[IronGecko]

What was that? lol j/k

 

[Ehatcher]

Wash your hands or use a hand sanitizer between handlings

 

[robin]

1) Just about everything you named, and also Salmonella. I found gram+ staphylococcus when I did a swabbing of my gecko's feet and poo corner for microbio lab last year.

A question though, is this JUST reptile parasites? Because if it's NOT I could go on and on about meningeal worms for hours .

Do reptiles get giardia? That's another water borne protozoan.

2) The best prevention (and this is one of my favorite sayings) is start with CLEAN HEALTHY Animals! Also, regular cleaning. Pick up poo as soon as you see it. And for goodness sakes change the water dish frequently, and don't just rinse it out, scrub it. The preceding is true for all animals.

3) Not all dewormers work on all parasites and not all antibiotics work on all bacteria, so I would look up the appropriate medication to use and seek the advice of a Knowledgeable veterinarian insofar as dosage. Oh yeah, and the best treatment is to finish the full course of antibiotics, don't stop and save the leftovers because "he's looking better".

Oh and there's a proposed treatment for crypto involving hyper-immune bovine colostrum, scientific papers on the topic detail varying levels of success (I'm pretty sure most of the papers are outdated though).

4) Again, ask me about meningeal worm and I'll go on for an hour . I know giardia and crypto, being protozoans, have a cyst stage and active stage making them really hard to kill once they're in the environment in cyst form.

5) Anorexia, weight loss, dehydration, runny feces, poor growth rate, and the ever so common JNR, just not right. These are just general symptoms for almost everything though, so nothing really diagnostic. Although most salmonella infections are sub-clinical and don't affect the reptile adversely, however this is why immunocompromised people are advised to not touch reptiles; an asymptomatic reptile may be shedding salmonella and you can guess the rest.

Um, that was all off the top of my head. So does anyone have anything to add?

let's just stick to reptiles

i like #1 start with healthy animals!

THANK YOU for posting!

 

[robin]

Wash your hands or use a hand sanitizer between handlings

very good point! not only keep your reptiles clean but keep yourself clean

 

[robin]

do disinfect or to not disinfect? like the nolvasan or chlorhexidine? what do these kill or rather what do they not kill

 

[KelliH]

I mainly use my Novalsan to spot clean a bin, or to clean my hands after slitting an egg or handling quarantine geckos.

 

[Keith N]

Quarantine is the thing I find most people do not do properly. How many times have you read that they recieved this animal and now it and another tankmate are having problems. I think a lot of people assume that just because it comes from this person or that place it must be o.k. but you never know and that is what you should plan for.

 

[RampantReptiles]

Also the stress of just being moved can cause a problem, lowered immune system and an animal that was fine is no longer fine... ugh this came out badly posting cause I cant sleep

 

[ILoveGeckos14]

Like how Kelli mentioned in another thread that some keepers might not be experienced enough to notice the subtle signs of an enigma with minor symptoms I feel the same way about parasites. I feel that sometimes the signs are so subtle you can easily miss them. I'm sorry if this offends people but I also feel like some are inexperienced so that they do not know how a gecko should be growing, or what a healthy gecko is. So it's hard for that reason to say, only treat the gecko if it is unhealthy or showing signs of illness because many people do not pick up on those things until it is a full blown problem. I have also seen some people in a fair amount of denial from wanting to pick up on these cues in the first place.
I have seen geckos that are infested and yet you would never be able to tell. For these reasons I think there should be a recommended yearly check up or if you have a lot of geckos take the skinny, slow growers as representatives of your collection. And try to get your new geckos checked out.

I also have to agree with Keith, proper quarantine could solve 50% of the problems that keepers encounter with their new geckos. i.e. bullying, parasites, accidental breeding ,stress related growth problems, etc...

Signs of parasites that I have seen:
Wandering about the cage aimlessly.
While wandering, doesn't seem to have any clue you are there, does not react in fear, does not eat if you throw food in at that moment.
Eating paper towel or cage substrate.
Dull colors.
Spurts of eating then not eating. Gaining and losing weight but staying relatively the same under a year of age.
Smelly stools - loose,brown/burgundy in color with hooks due to the caked blood I imagine.
Skin sunken in around the back of the skull behind the ear holes and pelvis.
Closing eyes around you- meaning they are aware you are there but close their eyes as if in pain or really lethargic.

 

[Keitone]

Like how Kelli mentioned in another thread that some keepers might not be experienced enough to notice the subtle signs of an enigma with minor symptoms I feel the same way about parasites. I feel that sometimes the signs are so subtle you can easily miss them. I'm sorry if this offends people but I also feel like some are inexperienced so that they do not know how a gecko should be growing, or what a healthy gecko is. So it's hard for that reason to say, only treat the gecko if it is unhealthy or showing signs of illness because many people do not pick up on those things until it is a full blown problem. I have also seen some people in a fair amount of denial from wanting to pick up on these cues in the first place.
I have seen geckos that are infested and yet you would never be able to tell. For these reasons I think there should be a recommended yearly check up or if you have a lot of geckos take the skinny, slow growers as representatives of your collection. And try to get your new geckos checked out.

I also have to agree with Keith, proper quarantine could solve 50% of the problems that keepers encounter with their new geckos. i.e. bullying, parasites, accidental breeding ,stress related growth problems, etc...

Signs of parasites that I have seen:
Wandering about the cage aimlessly.
While wandering, doesn't seem to have any clue you are there, does not react in fear, does not eat if you throw food in at that moment.
Eating paper towel or cage substrate.
Dull colors.
Spurts of eating then not eating. Gaining and losing weight but staying relatively the same under a year of age.
Smelly stools - loose,brown/burgundy in color with hooks due to the caked blood I imagine.
Skin sunken in around the back of the skull behind the ear holes and pelvis.
Closing eyes around you- meaning they are aware you are there but close their eyes as if in pain or really lethargic.

What is a good resource for newbs to learn about these things? While the internet does have lots of info, sometimes just sorting through all the conflicting and misinformation can be daunting and frustrating.

I bought the book that Robin suggested, are there any others?

 

[robin]

there are many good books! let me look in my stash and i bet many other can contribute some books titles are well. basic books to more advanced book would be great and ANY reptile books not just leopard geckos!

come on guys

oh by the way
here is another really good book

"what's wrong with my snake?"

 

[FloridaNature]

This forum is better than any book!

Thanks,
FloridaNature

 

[fl_orchidslave]

Today while cleaning the cage of my fav female (in a 10 gallon by herself) I noticed her poop was crawling with small white worms! She is fat healthy & active & I have never seen them in here feces before!

What is my next step?

Thanks,
FloridaNature

You will need to get your animal and a fresh poop for the fecal test to a HERP vet to get the proper meds and dosage instruction.

 

[T-ReXx]

Speaking from the Veterinary world, there are a few steps you can do to prevent/control parasites. Some have been mentioned already, but I'll go over what we generally recommend.

1) QUARANTINE. Quarantining not only new animals, but animals that show the slightest sign of health issues will immensely help prevent the spread of disease and parasites. Take care of quarantined animals last, wash your hands in between every cage, and observe animals carefully.

2) DISINFECTION. I personally use Chlorahexidine with my animals, and a 10% bleach solution for major cleanings. At our practice, we use Chlorahex to clean just about everything; rooms, tables, counters, cages, equipment, even skin before surgery. This is for outwardly healthy animals. With animals that show signs or are suspected of carrying transmittable diseases or parasites, we bleach everything the animal came in contact with. I also change clothes between my reptile room and the quarantine room, I keep a set of scrubs for working in the quarantine room specifically.

VECTOR PREVENTION. Parasites all have life cycles and vectors that allow them to pass between hosts. Fecal material and prey items are the most common of these. Remove fecal material whenever you see it and don't recycle prey items. If prey is uneaten, either dispose of it or keep it seperate to be offered to the same animal next feeding day.

TESTING. I find it very disconcerting just how little emphasis is put on this. Regular fecal tests are rather inexpensive and do a great deal to identify a parasite problem before it becomes health-threatening. I do twice yearly fecals on all my animals, established and new alike. Now, I work in a vet hospital, so I can do my own fecals on my own time using hospital equipment, and I'm trained to recognize parasites. For the average hobbyist; go to a vet. Even if you have a larger collection, a group sample(per species) is better than nothing. If you do find parasites, DON'T MEDICATE YOURSELF. It's ridiculously easy to kill reptiles with misdiagnosed and misdosed medications. Do yourself and the animals a favor and have a vet do the diagnosing/dosing.

There are other things you can do to prevent problems, but most of them are common sense. Wash your hands, keep cages clean, change water regularly, keep the animals in suitable environments, etc. You have to remember that in the animal world, showing weakness will often get you eaten, so animals who are actually showing overt signs of disease or parasites are usually REALLY bad off. They can hide it surprisingly well, so prevention is the major key.