Thoughts on Black Eyed Enigmas??

[paulnj]

That theory hold as much water as any, just wanted to clear up the codom thing before anyone racks their brain with that trait in mind.

Mind boggling to say the least.

 

[malt_geckos]

I was also thinking that the enigma can act as a gene unlocker. Theories always need improvement in the beginning.

And I was wrong calling it co dominant...atleast for now. It could change.

 

[PacHerp]

Opps...I missed that in Mallorie's post. I was reading too fast and thought she was recommending that perhaps a the Mack SS eye trait could be expressed when crossed with another dom. trait...or said another way, the eye trait "un locks" when crossed with any other type of dominant trait...whether it be incomplete dom., co-dom, or dom. (hence the gem snow comment)
Again, I'm just shooting in the dark here...you genetic experts jump in, please...

I do think this is an interesting topic if discussion... but as to how and why... I have no idea.

I think the mack snow enigmas with black eyes look super cool, as I've seen Debbie's and they are unreal in person! I'll be watching this thread.

 

[Gazz]

Lol! You guys are funny! I have a thought.

When combinding mack snow and Mack snow we get a super snow. The super snow is the result of the two co dominant traits combinding.

Maybe we don't get the black eyes as just the result of the combination of co dom Mack snow to co dom Mack snow. Maybe the black eyes are the result of cominding two co dom color morphs. So Mack snow to enigma. Both of which are co dominant traits. Maybe the two co dom traits cause the same reaction in the genes that we get when crossing Mack to Mack.

Just a thought.

Mallorie

But you can get black eyed mack snow offspring from a mack snow X blizzard-(Co-dom X Recessive) but the black eye doesn't seem to click on the normal(non mack) offspring from a mack X blizzard breeding.

 

[preacherman]

So far the few all of the Mack Enigmas with black eyes have two solid black eyes, right? No snake eyes? Also, does anyone know if any were produced last season?

 

[Kotsay1414]

To my understanding, the Mack Snow/Super Snow trait is Incomplete Dominate. When a trait in incomplete dominate, it is a blend of two traits. Take mice for example. If you cross a Black Mouse with a White Mouse, you will get grey mice. This is the same as a Super Snow x Normal, you will get Mack Snows that show varying amounts of yellow and white. With that said, I also think you can produce solid black eyes and snake eyes in Mack Snows without using a eclipse trait (from RAPTORs or Blizzards). I have included a thread that has a picture of a Snake Eyed Mack Snow.

Now with the Enigma crosses into Super Snows and Mack Snows, this has shown more often than not that we can have Snake Eyes or Solid(Eclipse) eyes in Mack Snows with no RAPTOR or Blizzard influence.

http://geckoforums.net/showthread.php?t=8721&highlight=Snake+Eye

 

[miamimike]

I have one mack snow enigma Jason, that has one solid eye and one snake eye.....I have one other that has regular non-solid eyes but is a mack enigma....for what it's worth

 

[bro paul]

I have one mack snow enigma Jason, that has one solid eye and one snake eye.....I have one other that has regular non-solid eyes but is a mack enigma....for what it's worth

Can you share pairings that made these...or would you have to kill us all?

 

[dprince]

Well, I think that we also need to clarify that two different genes might be creating the black eyes..........the "eclipse" gene, in which you can have snake eyes, and the "super snow eye" gene (since I don't have something more clever at the moment), in which the eyes are solid black.

The ones I have produces have no eclipse influence what so ever, so if they snaked out.........I'd probably faint. OK, so maybe not THAT dramatic - but I'd be hugely shocked. :shocked:

 

[PacHerp]

Well, I think that we also need to clarify that two different genes might be creating the black eyes..........the "eclipse" gene, in which you can have snake eyes, and the "super snow eye" gene (since I don't have something more clever at the moment), in which the eyes are solid black.

The ones I have produces have no eclipse influence what so ever, so if they snaked out.........I'd probably faint. OK, so maybe not THAT dramatic - but I'd be hugely shocked. :shocked:

Debbie, you never cease to crack me up with your posts! I am right with you on the fainting part, though. haha. That would just be unreal....

I'm looking forward to everyone's opinions on this thread... what a cool topic!

 

[yellermelon]

I like the 25% theory. It makes sence. There are a few people whom I think may have hatched enough mack X enigma geckos to shed some light on this as far as "percentages" go. I guess we will need to wait and see what further breedings brings us. Also I am interested in seeing what a solid eyed mack enigma het albino X solid eyed mack enigma het albino would produce...likewise a normal eyed mack enigma het albino X solid eyed mack enigma het albino/....

 

[miamimike]

Paul....
The pairing was non-albino enigma het raptor x non-albino mack snow 66% het raptor female....produced both animals in two different clutches...the other siblings were a snake eyed eclipse (non mack) animal and the dreaded banded normal

 

[preacherman]

I have one mack snow enigma Jason, that has one solid eye and one snake eye.....I have one other that has regular non-solid eyes but is a mack enigma....for what it's worth

But there's a possibility that the one with snake-eyes could be from the actual eclipse gene, right?

 

[preacherman]

Paul....
The pairing was non-albino enigma het raptor x non-albino mack snow 66% het raptor female....produced both animals in two different clutches...the other siblings were a snake eyed eclipse (non mack) animal and the dreaded banded normal

I guess that's the answer to my previous question.

 

[malt_geckos]

But you can get black eyed mack snow offspring from a mack snow X blizzard-(Co-dom X Recessive) but the black eye doesn't seem to click on the normal(non mack) offspring from a mack X blizzard breeding.

But couldn't that be the blizzard eye trait? Or maybe not...since it's recessive....goodness...

I am referring strictly to the Mack SS eye trait here...I have no idea how enigmas and the blizzard eye (eclipse) trait work.

hmmm...my theory seems like poo now. :main_no: Geesh...back to the drawing board.lol

 

[Jevtar]

With so many great people working on this, it wont be long (rubbing hands in anticipation)*

 

[eyelids]

Throw some Mack Blizzards in the mix and it'll get even more confusing... :main_laugh:

But couldn't that be the blizzard eye trait? Or maybe not...since it's recessive....

It's not recessive... I proved that two years ago...

 

[malt_geckos]

Ok, I thought that with that one gecko with snake eyes.

 

[paulnj]

Mallorie, your theory about the mack gene and enigma gene combo is a very valid theory, just not Codom until proven otherwise. Most assumed codom traits are not infact codom in my opinion anyway:main_yes: With that said, 2 [incomplete] dominant genes could indeed combine and enhance or unlock a eye trait.

 

[boutiquegecko]

Might have missed this-are these only popping up with mack gene as one of the breeders? Or with other enigma crosses with no mack involved? Just wondering if it's the mack gene. Haven't other solid eyes popped up with mack crosses that are not mack x mack or ss involved?