Curly Tail Leopard Gecko ???

[JordanAng420]

Really? So the breeders that originally came up with Tangs and Hypos and Carrot Tails and any combo morph are unethical?

I think what a lot of us are trying to say is that it's different when you breed for a specific color rather than a physical trait like curled or kinked tails.

I'll elaborate on the chihuahua example: One breeder breeds the dog because she wants a dark brown chihuahua with white spots. So she breeds and breeds until she either gives up or is sucessful. Not a wonderful idea, IMO. But the other breeder breeds the dog because they think it's cute how they hobble around with their kneecaps genetically twisted. Or worse, because they think it's "gorgeous" so it shouldn't matter if mom passes the mange infestation she has to her puppies.

Kelli's right. It's like comparing apples and oranges.

 

[justindh1]

Either way its something that none of us are for sure and everyone is jumping the gun on this. If we were all this ethical then the enigma would of been history along time ago but obviously we are not. :main_laugh: Come on people it can't be right in one situation but not right in another. We know that the enigma isn't going to be cured all the way but we still breed them.

Maybe this need to be examined by a professional who can state whether there is underlying problems instead of everyone guessing about something that most people don't know much about. Lets not tell the guy to get rid of them and stop just because of peoples guesses and opinions. Opinions are definitly one sided here.

 

[Baoh]

There is so much misinformation in this thread I don't even know where to start.

It's a complete waste of time to start.

 

[chazthaking2]

my opinion is do all the test breeding yourself and if anyone else wants to jump on that wagon so be it. Theyre yours, maybe you really do have something but find out what you have first. dabble around a bit and one day someone may really want them.

 

[chazthaking2]

a lot of people usually see the cup as half empty when it comes to reptiles but nothing is really pure anymore. everything has something to do with a trait that someone wants. if you like these curly tails, then someone else will. prove everybody right!!

 

[jandsfannon]

Im going to throw in my 2 cents. Im not going to say they are undesireable, because maybe someone will like them BUT the fact that as they are being bred back to each other the curl is getting more pronounced, that shows that it is a deformity. I have seen a curly tailed Leo in person a breeder was selling it at a local reptile expo, that did not look comfortable for the gecko, there was nothing visibly wrong with the gecko other than the curly tail but it looked like it was uncomfortable. It couldnt move its tail as it normally would.
As to the comparison with Enigmas, those of us that are working with them are working to breed OUT the problems, not continue them. As I have seen this year with each out crossing the problem is beginning to "go away" with each new generation. Speaking for myself and Im sure others working with enigmas would say the same thing, If there was no improvements working to breed out the problems....I would not be working with them.
Just be responsible, those are beautiful geckos....but dont breed in a deformity, work to breed it out.

 

[mlw50]

Im going to throw in my 2 cents. Im not going to say they are undesireable, because maybe someone will like them BUT the fact that as they are being bred back to each other the curl is getting more pronounced, that shows that it is a deformity.

I'll go back to my Tang example here. Tangs were bred back to eachother to achive the orange color. The fact that it becomes more pronounced when bred back shows that the curled-tail is a polygenic trait because family members have more alleles in common with eachother. In breeding(to an extent) has never been considered unethical in the leopard gecko community. The only way it would be considered a deformity is if it impaired the viability of the organism, which there has been no proof of.

 

[KelliH]

It's a complete waste of time to start.

You mean like your post is?

 

[KelliH]

Opinions are definitly one sided here.

Everyone is entitled to an opinion here. That's the beauty of having intelligent discussion. It seems the majority of us feel one way about these geckos. It doesn't mean we are right or wrong. Now can the subject be dropped now? Thanks!

 

[thestack510]

Everyone is entitled to an opinion here. That's the beauty of having intelligent discussion.

:main_thumbsup: It just seems obvious to me that this can develop into a problem if the curvature is fostered. I doubt scoliosis, or the Leopard Gecko equivalent, would make for a fun existence, especially when the geckos have to hunt for food. It seems bass ackwards to me to be working a physical problem into your livestock... just my thoughts on it. I wish the best for the animals whatever the breeder decides to do with them.

 

[KelliH]

I'm going to go ahead and close this thread. I think evryone has had a chance to express how they feel about the subject.