POLL - NAMING MORPHS

[bleeding_sarcasm]

Do you get to pick and choose your moments of responsibility? Sounds like a pretty sweet deal. I want in! hahaha Im just giving you **** haha

 

[Rejoice in the Lord]

. . . a few pages back, someone said something about people not voting. I opened this thread thinking that I might learn a bit more about what morphs are what . . . and I have learned some why I have been so confused. Some of them really are the same things, just getting called different things by different people. I haven't decided what ya'll should do about it though.

Maybe think of the fancy names as the common name, and use the genetics name after it (like Latin scientific names and common names ; an example from my mom's garden-Bachelor's Buttons and Cornflower are both Centaurea cyanus)? Then, if you want to make it short, standardize abreviations for the genetics name. If the genetics name always follows the fancy name, then it will be easier for newbs to learn what is what as they go and figure things out. (Like the seed packets - some say BACHOLOR'S BUTTONS centaurea cyanus while others will say CORNFLOWER centaurea cyanus) People who like the fun names will use the fun name; people who want the accurite name will use them, and everyone will get more familliar with both.

Let's see . . . I know what Tang is
I know there are three different albinos, but I don't know which is which
sort of have an idea what Snow means (basicly black and white spotted?)
Hi yellow and carrot tail are simple enough
I think I understand Jungle
Giant makes sense
I've read about red eyes, and snake eyes, but don't see what the fuss is all about.
More confused than ever about the different patternlesses. I didn't even know there was more than one before reading this thread.

My interest is only so that when my friend says "I'm getting a djoldhlsf", I know sort of what their gecko looks like without having to look at a picture of one.

. . . goes off to vote for #7 . . .

It has been an interesting discussion!

 

[GroovyGeckos.com]

Matt & Alberto,

I do not think that everything will be "perfect" all of the time, so for everyone to agree is just not going to happen. But.. I see no reason why someone cannot take some of this as "advice", put any hurt feelings aside, and understand that this will cause alot of problems when we have about twenty more morphs. Read it, take it in, and you will probably learn something from it. If you do not take all of this so negatively, I mean. If you see that over 95% of the people that have voted, are not for renaming combination morphs, why would you push the issue. It is already pretty well known, this is not how we do things with LG`s, and this thread is pretty good "evidence" of the fact.

Now you guys are going to be one of the first to be "different", and it will only cause others to do the same. Do you not understand, that names will soon begin to spiral out of control? Do you really want to risk being "the guy that caused" all of that? What will whoever hatches them, name the Bell or Rainwater "Dreamsickle"? You can almost bet, it will not have anything to do with your morph name. Meaning more confusion, more names, more egos, blah blah blah. That is something we all should be trying to avoid here!

There really has not been anything but respectfully made posts here, about the concerns that something like this brings up. I`de be stubborn too, if I already had made a name for something, and then heard all of this, but it would make me re-think what I was doing, that is for sure. Read the posts, and do not take it all so personally, then it is easy to see this is not a good choice to make. It is not going to benefit anyone in the long run. You guys already made the morph, everyone knows that, and a new name for it is really not going to make a difference, at all. It is a beautiful morph, and the appearance/genetics alone make it desirable, not whatever name you want to give it.

Not many people spend hundreds, much less thousands on single Leos. So who does it benefit, to let the egos get in the way, and come off as being so defensive? I just mean, you thought that people posting their opinions on something that could help you, was an "attack". If anything, you are loosing the respect of the people that would have been potential customers, by taking offense, and not taking this into consideration.:main_huh:

First you guys said this was just easier for you, but I do not think that making a post with "the name" for the new combination, reflects upon that. No matter what you do, you will need to say, or type out all of the traits involved, just to explain to someone what it is, so you have not made any less work for yourself by "shortening" it either. Then it seems some feelings were hurt by the use of the word "ego". It`s not cool, but it is easy to misunderstand an "ego" comment, the way I see it. We all have an ego "to protect", and it is certainly not a negative thing, unless your ego is just way too big. I don`t think anyone meant it that way, but anyway. So by now you understand what I mean when I say ego, but how can this not be something to do with an ego, when you basically state(not word for word) "This is how we will do things, regardless of what everyone is saying"?

Seems kind of stubborn(like I said I`de be too) at this point, not to just say the heck with the name, when you have so many people sharing an almost identical view on it`s "downsides", and what can ultimately happen. I do not neccessarily like the name Black Hole, nor Dreamsickle, but that is not what this is about, at all. It is about keeping things as simple as possible, and representing all of the genetics accurately. That just can not be done with only one word. That is all I have to say.

who cares all of you stop fighting you buntch of old wrinkled baby godddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddd dddddd
by the way all of you are STUPID

Wow, did we all cause that? LOL

 

[MSMD]

I chose the third option, but I am in favor of naming distinguished lines among a single morph... Using Tangerines as an example: Tangerine Tornado, Electric Tangerine, HG Tang, etc. etc...

I agree with Michael on this.....while calling them all Tangs, it's consistant so there is no question as to what they are, but it also let's you know what lines they're from. I do like that. :main_yes:

 

[KelliH]

Dan, that is not only the best post I have ever seen you make, that is one of the best and most heartfelt posts I have seen on any leopard gecko forum. Mega kudos.

 

[KelliH]

who cares all of you stop fighting you buntch of old wrinkled baby godddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddddd dddddd
by the way all of you are STUPID

o rly?

 

[GekkoGalaksen]

I wish my english was better when threads like this comes up!
That is one reason that Im not writing so much...
But I must put in a little coment!

I don´t understand why we must agree or disagree on matter like this...someone things it´s okey, someone not. It´s like that with many many things we see and hear everyday. And we often learn to accept it...it´s simply the way it works.
There is a lot of red aples in the world...and they have a lot of different names. And even if they look a like, there is a difference. Some taste sweeter then others...I like the sweetest and "you" want one that taste a little more sour.
So if Alberto and Matt calls one of their geckos "Nova" and another breeder calls the same combo "Avon"...it´s your choise when you comes to buying one of these geckos. It will probably be a little (or big) difference between the breeders breeding result, and you will find one that you like more...and you will be a proud owner of what ever you buy, beacuse you picked out the one you liked the most.

You can also chose to call your gecko ( after buying it ) what you want...if you prefere to call your Electric Line or Tornado for a Tangerine it´s up to you. But I can tell that here in europe buyers want to know whats behind the gecko they are planing to buy...the more info the better.

If Alberto and Matt want´s to give their new combos new names, it´s their choice. And if I know these guys the "Quasar" is starting to get closer

 

[ByRandom]

Kind of like Global Warming, I think that we all need to step back - look a few years ahead - and unbiasedly look at the legacy that we will leave behind. More than likely, it's not going to be as big of an issue as Global Warming. I doubt that my children's children are going to be affected by whatever I decide to name a certain morph of reptile.

What I am concerned about is all of the posts that can be found from Fauna, Kingsnake, and even here with a title of "What's the Difference Between HYBINO and SUNGLOW?". Now multiply that by all of the morphs that have been "created" this year alone...

I believe that because of these "new morphs" we all will be inundated with e-mail after e-mail inquiring about whether or not "Morph A" is the same as "Morph B". Not only with this be a burden on the "creator" to have to continually defend their name and bloodline, but it will also fall on us, the patrons of Forums who are In-The-Know to respond to these questions time and time again. Personally, that is why I stopped visiting many forums in the past.

I don't want my legacy to be that I created more hardships on my fellow breeders, hobbyists, and friends.

 

[A&M Gecko]

If it's OK to have an opinion about it, and chat about it, why isn't it right to put the question out on a public poll to see how everyone feels about it? Not one of the poll questions asked anyone if it's right or wrong... it is just asking what people's opinions are. If you take a look at the votes, you will see what the majority of people think. As a breeder, I happen to care about what people think about these things.

Marcia
as I said, I know at least 10 people that did not even vote because you only put on the poll the choices you wanted.
I do not remember Prehistoric pets caring for anyone opinion when I named the albino blizzard a blazing blizzard, or TUG when I come up with sunglow, phantoms and tornado, the electric line, the dalmations the firewater, I can come up with as many names as you want. Many of us feel the same with line bred stuff, if we all have a name for our line of tangerine how many of those we will have? This is not something I started and we have been talking about this like never before, I just wonder why? As Dan posted before, if we care what people think we shouldn't do this. I do no remember any of those names were asked about before they were made official, why start now when is an exiting year for us and we are hatching all this incredible stuff?
We want to do the right thing, then lets delete all that is done before us and we can start from scratch, I do not accept to be the victim here when everybody else had done what ever they want.
If you guys think I do not care what other breeders think I can say worse about the others that came up with a name and didn't even debate about, line bred stuff works the same for me as new combo morphs but I do not remember that there was ever a pool about it.
Alberto

 

[miamimike]

Is this subject matter REALLY this essential?.....Is the Leopard gecko market really going to spiral helplessly into an oblivian if we dont all agree that there is only one way in all this?....Please Please Please trust me it wont!....Again, I have seen the same exact arguements in the tropical fish industry for years and years and years.....nothing is accomplished...only much effort trying to prevent the inevitable....much time and effort expressing a dire dire need to standardize...to use latin terminology....and it is alll sooooooo counter-productive. If we used HALF the amount of time and energy that has already been spent debating this issue on here and came up with (and I think one is already being created) a data base of names for different morphs...combos...whatever.....it would be a dead issue. No egos being attacked....no clans being formed......for me it is that kind of thing that has made me shy away from the ball python market WAY WAY WAY more than any naming thing. And that is obviuosly not the intention here...but it is headed there.....we can say...oh....we are just having a debate.....but we all know it is beginning to escalate into more than that.....and for me that is much more important to control than any name games. It is easy to blow things into a grand grand important issue when we think one way or the other strongly. Maybe we should step back....absolutely understand we arent going to be able to agree on or control certain things...and instead come up with a solution to this. A data base of names seems so obvious to me.....if you look at this poll....only 12% of the people voted to use the parents morph lineage as a way of naming things. So if you want to speak of majorities....the majority obviously doesnt think that is the answer....it was an option on this poll spelled out very clearly and NOT chosen by MOST. So lets work on an answer. We are all more than capable of doing this. It has been started...so lets get together and finish it and squelch this debate that is becoming less of a FRIENDLY debate and more of a "black-hole" in itself! Again, just my humble humble, VERY HUMBLE (did I remember to say humble) opinion.

 

[boutiquegecko]

Dan that was really good.

I want to say it seem that it's not even just the names for these enigma crosses but there are some other morph crosses that have names that have nothing to do w/ the genetics too and just as confusing. Unlikely, but maybe those breeders will stop by and see the majority vote and take that into consideration.
I mean look at how many people are crossing enigmas to other morphs-that's a lot of people and a lot of crosses-why does every single cross need a new name?

 

[A&M Gecko]

Mike
as I said, I do not want to go in a bad road I just want to take a fair one. I can work thing out but why I have to be the only one. Look at my site, every thing I come up with as a page with description about it and enough information for people to know what is it, look at the patternless stripe page or the rainbow stripe page. I will also add enough information on my site for people to know exactly what are the genetics in each animal they buy and there forward everyone if free to call it whatever they want. People will know that a NOVA is an enigma raptor and there forward they can call it just enigma raptor. As simple as that, now if we decide as gecko community not to make new names up for new combo morphs or selective bred lines lets start deleting the names that are already out there and being used and we continue from here.
In addition, like you said, a data base as well for information will be also a great help.
Alberto

 

[miamimike]

For what's it's worth Alberto.....I do not have a problem with you or anyone naming their creations at all!......I personally think it adds alot to the "fun" of this whole thing.....and I think your additions to your website in regards to the names is an awesome one!....Why cant we even make up a data base of names and include it on this forum as a help to all its users?...everytime you sign on to the forum it would be there to help everyone in their questions about the names.

 

[A&M Gecko]

I mean look at how many people are crossing enigmas to other morphs-that's a lot of people and a lot of crosses-why does every single cross need a new name?

Not every single cross, just the more meaningfully in my opinion, Enigma, raptors and mack snow are the newest and exciting morph out there and those combinations in my opinion deserve a new name. I have hatched enigma blizzard already, did I give it a new name, no, about enigma blazing blizzard, no new name there either, raptor enigma, well this is something that deserved it in my opinion, likewise with mack snow eclipse enigma and the mack snow raptor enigma, there are all 3 newest morph combined in this animal, yes, in my opinion it deserves a new name and Dreamsikle is perfect for me, is a dream animal and sick like the new generation says about a great car or some they like, in my opinion this is perfect. Why use the name Nova, this also was well thought because then anyone will know what a super nova is, a super snow raptor enigma. Again, these are my opinions and I do not see anything wrong with it.
Alberto

 

[A&M Gecko]

For what's it's worth Alberto.....I do not have a problem with you or anyone naming their creations at all!......I personally think it adds alot to the "fun" of this whole thing.....and I think your additions to your website in regards to the names is an awesome one!....Why cant we even make up a data base of names and include it on this forum as a help to all its users?...everytime you sign on to the forum it would be there to help everyone in their questions about the names.

I have the same opinion about the fun part, but that makes only 3 of us I guess, lol. I can only do what I think is right, give people as much info as possible about what I sell and I will not be unhappy to give all my input and info to a data base anywhere about leopard geckos, this is for sure.
Alberto

 

[Brhaco]

Great points Alberto-and I have to say that what I see is a wide diversity of opinion as to how naming should be gone about, certainly no consensus (at least not on this poll or thread).

I do see a lot of "heartfelt" posts that basically boil down to "All you big successful breeders, could you please, please be reasonable and do it MY way?"

As said above-things will be fine, the gecko hobby will only get bigger and better, and as for morphs, breeders and newbies alike will figure it out....or fall by the wayside.

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

Marcia
as I said, I know at least 10 people that did not even vote because you only put on the poll the choices you wanted.
I do not remember Prehistoric pets caring for anyone opinion when I named the albino blizzard a blazing blizzard, or TUG when I come up with sunglow, phantoms and tornado, the electric line, the dalmations the firewater, I can come up with as many names as you want. Many of us feel the same with line bred stuff, if we all have a name for our line of tangerine how many of those we will have? This is not something I started and we have been talking about this like never before, I just wonder why? As Dan posted before, if we care what people think we shouldn't do this. I do no remember any of those names were asked about before they were made official, why start now when is an exiting year for us and we are hatching all this incredible stuff?
We want to do the right thing, then lets delete all that is done before us and we can start from scratch, I do not accept to be the victim here when everybody else had done what ever they want.
If you guys think I do not care what other breeders think I can say worse about the others that came up with a name and didn't even debate about, line bred stuff works the same for me as new combo morphs but I do not remember that there was ever a pool about it.
Alberto

Alberto, I am not sure why it seems you are directing most of your arguments towards me, but MANY others have expressed their opinions and feelings on this informative and interesting thread that have been much more direct than I have. I have not seen one single person (me included) single-out any particular breeder, so I'm sorry if you are taking it as a personal attack.

No one is suggesting that we 'start from scratch' with naming morphs... they are suggesting that we ALL need to take into consideration the frustration and confusion the general community is having keeping track of all the names breeders are giving their 'new' combination morphs in the future.

I do see a lot of "heartfelt" posts that basically boil down to "All you big successful breeders, could you please, please be reasonable and do it MY way?"

I don't see anyone dictating how things should be done... just sharing how they feel about the way we are currently doing things and asking help from breeders to take it into consideration. I think one of the things that makes a breeder successful is listening and taking into consideration what the public, our customers, need and want!

 

[that_guy]

I don't think combination morphs deserve their own new name, only NEW genetic traits or signature line bred morphs.

However, I believe that there should be some sort of standardized system that we can all abide by. Why can't it be done? A few years back, my mom used to be into orchids. There is an orchid society. My aunt bred angel fish. There is an angel fish society. We breed leopard geckos. Why can't there be a leopard gecko society? Kind of like a governing body for leopard gecko breeders. One that creates standards on issues such as this. A group of people that have the "final say" I guess.

The "Leopard Gecko Society" could have people that want to be members sign up, and pay dues, much like the other societies. In turn they would be "Certified Leopard Gecko Society" members, and would abide by the set standards. I don't know. Just a thought. Seems to me, its the way to go, and would solve this whole debate.

 

[Golden Gate Geckos]

http://www.geckoforums.net/showpost.php?p=154505&postcount=103

Dan, this is the BEST post you have ever made!

 

[Mel&Keith]

I guess there's a core group of people on here who try to answer all of the questions about what's the difference between morph A and B or how do I make this morph. How many newbies know what the difference between a Phantom, a Snowglow, and a Creamsicle is? Heck, I can barely keep them all straight. That's why the majority would rather just have them be called Hybino Snows or SHT Snows. I think this has been a great that everyone has been respectfully voicing their concerns and opinions. Hooray for 12 pages of discussion with no fighting!