Bio-active substrate!!!

[acpart]

I will say that while I use similar types of substrate for AFT's and my tiny coleonyx, the leos and the beardie are on ceramic tile (with eco earth lay boxes) because of concerns about the humidity. I could probably do it another way but this has worked best so far.

Aliza

 

[Gregg M]

I will say that while I use similar types of substrate for AFT's and my tiny coleonyx, the leos and the beardie are on ceramic tile (with eco earth lay boxes) because of concerns about the humidity. I could probably do it another way but this has worked best so far.

Aliza

Aliza,
I have some leos in a bio-active setup... You can still get the same results with less humidity...

This is why I am so certain that leos do not get impacted on natural substrates when they are kept properly...

 

[Tony C]

Great info John, thanks for posting. Oak is one of the preferred leaf litter types for froggers as well, in addition to magnolia, live(evergreen) oak and sea grape.

 

[acpart]

Aliza,
I have some leos in a bio-active setup... You can still get the same results with less humidity...

This is why I am so certain that leos do not get impacted on natural substrates when they are kept properly...

Another issue for me with the substrate is that most of my leos are in front-opening cages. The only front-opening cage I have with a substrate like this is for my coleonyx and I had to make a wall of low tile in front of the door so the substrate wouldn't come out. I'm willing to consider it for leos, but it's not on my immediate agenda.

Aliza

 

[Gregg M]

I'm willing to consider it for leos, but it's not on my immediate agenda.

Aliza

Well if and when you ever get around to doing so, you will be glad you did...:main_thumbsup:

 

[robin]

Aliza,
I have some leos in a bio-active setup... You can still get the same results with less humidity...

This is why I am so certain that leos do not get impacted on natural substrates when they are kept properly...

i thought you were going to start testing it on the smaller reptiles? like leopard geckos. i was under the assumption you had not kept any on it from the way you spoke before :main_huh:

 

[Landen]

Like I said, not everyone needs to use a bio-active substrate... If you are happy and content using paper towels, that is fine... There certainly is no danger in that and it obviously works great and the reptiles kept on paper towels thrive just fine...

The exact same thing can be said for natural bio-active substrates... This is just an alternative to keeping reptiles in lab like conditions...

I use both methods at the moment and both work great... However, like I stated, I am doing trial now in my racks to see how it works... If all works out well, I will never use a paper towel as a substrate again...

Just a side note, you can be particular about what insects you allow to colonize your bio-active substrate... You can use peatmoss, organic topsoil, wood mulch, and play sand and then add the insect species you want...

Personally, I do not bother doing it that way...

don't get me wrong, I think it's great that your exploring this. I was joking a bit. My ways not broken yet so what's working will remain but I still think it would be cool to do in the future. It takes people like you to find out if it works. Good luck with your trials!

 

[Johnantny]

Its no trial, its a proven way to keep herps. Even back in the days when De Vosjoli was putting out How To books and pushing these methods, and folks thought he was nuts. I think as a whole, reptile keeping has become too much about the keeper and less about the kept. Paper towels, aspen, bark chips- these are cruel and unusual to me, as is repti- carpet, screen tops, and 90 degree basking temps but thats a whole other argument that I'd love to get into another time. When I first made the switch to leaves and sand, the lizards knew exactly what to do in it- burrow. When I upped the basking temps to degrees closer to what nature provides, they began to reproduce. When I saw a system working for me, little bugs doing tasks that saved me time and toil I was thrilled.

 

[KelliH]

Its no trial, its a proven way to keep herps. Even back in the days when De Vosjoli was putting out How To books and pushing these methods, and folks thought he was nuts. I think as a whole, reptile keeping has become too much about the keeper and less about the kept. Paper towels, aspen, bark chips- these are cruel and unusual to me, as is repti- carpet, screen tops, and 90 degree basking temps but thats a whole other argument that I'd love to get into another time. When I first made the switch to leaves and sand, the lizards knew exactly what to do in it- burrow. When I upped the basking temps to degrees closer to what nature provides, they began to reproduce. When I saw a system working for me, little bugs doing tasks that saved me time and toil I was thrilled.

Paper towels are cruel? So because I keep my geckos on paper towel I am being cruel? Screen tops are cruel? Forgive me, but are you serious?



Sent from my T-Mobile G1 using Tapatalk

 

[Gregg M]

i thought you were going to start testing it on the smaller reptiles? like leopard geckos. i was under the assumption you had not kept any on it from the way you spoke before :main_huh:

No, I said I will be testing it in racks... I have already done it for years with smaller species just not in racks...

 

[Gregg M]

Paper towels are cruel? So because I keep my geckos on paper towel I am being cruel? Screen tops are cruel? Forgive me, but are you serious?

Kelli, when it comes to large monitors and snakes that need deep substrates, large spaces, and high ambient and basking temps, yes, it is cruel...

For other reptiles that do not have such requirements Paper towels are perfectly fine...

You need to keep in mind, John is not a gecko guy so when he talks it is through his experience with monitors...

 

[Landen]

maybe you should keep in mind that your posting in a leopard gecko forum, not a monitor forum. To say that our methods are cruel after the amount of effort we put in to make sure that our animals are prime, sound like a slap in the mouth to me......

Kelli, I guess we're just too cruel to our fat and happy animals......:main_thumbsdown:

 

[Next Level Geckos]

I am going to give this a try with tortoises. I can't say its good or bad until I try it.

 

[Tony C]

maybe you should keep in mind that your posting in a leopard gecko forum, not a monitor forum. To say that our methods are cruel after the amount of effort we put in to make sure that our animals are prime, sound like a slap in the mouth to me......

Kelli, I guess we're just too cruel to our fat and happy animals......:main_thumbsdown:

Why take it so personally when he was not aiming his comments at geckos? Advancements in the hobby come through open-minded exchange of ideas, not by taking a personal stake in one method of husbandry over another.

 

[55g]

Gregg M, how would you provide belly heat (for leopard geckos) with a bio-active substrate?

 

[KelliH]

Why take it so personally when he was not aiming his comments at geckos? Advancements in the hobby come through open-minded exchange of ideas, not by taking a personal stake in one method of husbandry over another.

He was speaking of reptiles in general. And, he posted it in the Leopard Gecko Forum. So yeah, it's a little annoying to read that it's cruel to keep reptiles on paper towels.

 

[acpart]

I'll let Greg describe how he provides belly heat, but here are the 2 things I've done:

for my AFT tank: I have 2/3 of the tank with clay balls, mesh and coco fiber to provide drainage for the plants. I have 1/3 of the tank with coco fiber only and a UTH. Two of the hides have ceramic bottoms and are set into the coco fiber so the fatties can't dig down to the glass bottom and burn themselves. The temp probe is actually in another tank (I have one of those thermostats that runs 3 UTH's). There's a piece of plexiglass set on its end to divide the 2 substrate types

For my coleonyx tank: I use heat cable under the tank and have a heat gradient that runs from back to front along the length of the tank. I ended up putting the coco fiber down and the hides along the back of the tank. I've checked and the substrate is warm. I'm watching them to make sure they don't dig too far. If they do, I"ll have to make ceramic bottomed hides for them too (I just set this one up last Sun.).

Aliza

 

[robin]

Kelli, when it comes to large monitors and snakes that need deep substrates, large spaces, and high ambient and basking temps, yes, it is cruel...

For other reptiles that do not have such requirements Paper towels are perfectly fine...

You need to keep in mind, John is not a gecko guy so when he talks it is through his experience with monitors...

he says aspen is cruel as well, which is what, if i remember correctly, you use on your hogs. many keepers including snake keepers i am sure would take offense to some of these comments as well.

john, if you feel as though you are better since you keep monitors it might be best to post on the monitor forums. the leopard gecko community is very tight and we tend to watch out for each other. many of the keepers on here have probably be keeping reptiles when you were in diapers.

also, do you know of zoo's that use this method?

 

[eric]

maybe you should keep in mind that your posting in a leopard gecko forum, not a monitor forum. To say that our methods are cruel after the amount of effort we put in to make sure that our animals are prime, sound like a slap in the mouth to me......

Kelli, I guess we're just too cruel to our fat and happy animals......:main_thumbsdown:

OK, let's watch where this is going. We're all friends here And Gregg explained John's post. No need for nasty comments. :main_thumbsup:

 

[robin]

No, I said I will be testing it in racks... I have already done it for years with smaller species just not in racks...

ok so what are you keeping your other leos in (the ones not in racks)? a glass tanks with a screen top?