Bio-active substrate!!!

[Ehatcher]

Dang, to much debate and hate in this thread.

If something works for you, whether you are using paper towel, tile, or leaf litter and it is working for you keep doing it. No need for people to pick other people apart for it. And it is especially nothing to get butt hurt over and bicker about.

 

[eric]

ok so what are you keeping your other leos in (the ones not in racks)? a glass tanks with a screen top?

Lets get back on topic. It's already been stated as a misunderstanding. Leave it alone!

 

[KelliH]

Dang, to much debate and hate in this thread.

If something works for you, whether you are using paper towel, tile, or leaf litter and it is working for you keep doing it. No need for people to pick other people apart for it. And it is especially nothing to get butt hurt over and bicker about.

No hate here at all. I was just speaking as KelliH a leopard gecko keeper.
Just because we disagree sometimes we all dig each other mostly, right? :smitten:

 

[paulnj]

I know all about pests and pesticides as a licenced pesticide applicator and the worst pesticides are inactive after 4 days I know about tree diseases and none affect fauna that I'm aware of

love that Bio-active substrate having seen , held, smell and watched rare dwarf monitors living in it for well over a year

 

[paulnj]

peace and love

 

[roger]

Group Hug LOL:main_laugh:

 

[Landen]

boy howdy !! don't take a stab at a leo breeder/keeper huh? Backup for days.... lol... gotta luv some forums...

 

[robin]

boy howdy !!

said like a true Texan. i cry tears of joy!

 

[Landen]

said like a true Texan. i cry tears of joy!

shhh... I'm an imposter.... :main_cool3:

 

[Gregg M]

boy howdy !! don't take a stab at a leo breeder/keeper huh? Backup for days.... lol... gotta luv some forums...

Hey Landen.
I am a leo keeper/breeder as well #1...

#2 I have explained what the comment was about and if you continue to try and insight more conflict there will be infractions given out... Another mod has stepped in and asked to keep things on topic so unless you have info or questions on bio-active substrates, do yourself a favor and just read...

Back on topic...

So far from my use and Johns use of bio-active substrates we have housed a few different species with different humidity requirements in cages that happen to NOT be AGAs with screen lids (LOL) and everything is in good order and we get to see some natural behaviors that you do not normally get to see... You really should see what leos do in natural substrates... In my opinion, seeing how they act naturally makes them even cooler...

Someone asked how I incorperate "belly heat" in a bio active substrate cage...
The fact is, I do not provide belly heat...

For instance in the natural leo cage they are set up with appox ten inches of substrate, no hideboxes, and no humid hide... Their hot spot is heated by a 45 watt flood light... Temp in the cage as of las night are as follows...

Hot spot- 115 degrees to 120 degrees

Ambient air temp- 84 degrees to 87 degrees

Under substrate and inside burrows 80 dgrees to 90 degrees depending on how deep and where the burrow is located...

Leos in this set up are very active and healthy... Just as healthy as the leos in the racks but clearly more active...

They are constantly on the move, thermoregulating and utilizing every inch of the cage including the 115 to 120 degree hot spot for short periods of time...

The will frequently bask during the day... Yes, they are nocturnal but they still need to thermoregulate during they day...

The burrows are naturally more humid than the top layer... This is especially true on the cool end... There have been no shedding issues at all... Once a week or so I will add some water to the substrate on the cool end just to be sure it stays humid...

Keep in mind that this is being done in a large cage and not in a rack or 20 gallon AGA...

My racks are back heated so I am certain that the heating will not be an issue... However, when I do test this system in a bin, I will be providing a humid hid box...

 

[ILoveGeckos14]

It would be really cool to see the natural instincts come out more. I feel like I get a glimpse of it when they dig in their coco fiber moisture hides. That's probably why a lot like to hang out in the humid hide all the time, it feels more natural. I've always wanted to hollow out a room and try something like this on a really large scale. But also have more than one male in the enclosure and see how/if they divide up the space into their respective territories and which male the females choose or is most successful at breeding the most females. Probably won't happen but I've thought about it

 

[Khrysty]

It would be really cool to see the natural instincts come out more. I feel like I get a glimpse of it when they dig in their coco fiber moisture hides. That's probably why a lot like to hang out in the humid hide all the time, it feels more natural. I've always wanted to hollow out a room and try something like this on a really large scale. But also have more than one male in the enclosure and see how/if they divide up the space into their respective territories and which male the females choose or is most successful at breeding the most females. Probably won't happen but I've thought about it

I've thought about it too...and I always think "one day, when I'm rich..." lol. I'd worry about losing a few, though. You're bound to get some poor hunters who die of starvation, or males that end up in the wrong place at the wrong time. I wouldn't be doing it with high-end morphs, that's for sure

 

[ILoveGeckos14]

I've thought about it too...and I always think "one day, when I'm rich..." lol. I'd worry about losing a few, though. You're bound to get some poor hunters who die of starvation, or males that end up in the wrong place at the wrong time. I wouldn't be doing it with high-end morphs, that's for sure

Haha I just pictured a bunch of high end morphs scattered around an enclosure like that. Imagine showing that on show off your cages, people would be like WTH!? :main_laugh:

 

[Johnantny]

You'd be suprised. The geckos know exactly what to do when they have the options available to behave more "naturally". Hi end morphs or normals, they will all behave similarly.

I wasn't meaning to incite any bad intent regarding my husbandry practice. I was just bringing some thoughts and experiences to the table regarding bioactive terrariums. Herpetoculture is ever evolving, and we can all learn something new here. The way I do it can be used for many species of reptiles, not just large lizards. I keep levis geckos, toads and a few box turtles in same fashion with great results. Good luck what ever you choose to do if its benefiting the animals.

Cheers

John

 

[sammer021486]

How does this set up work for breeding pairs?

I have been thinking doing a coco fiber natural setup for my crested geckos and was planning on using pill bugs, but one of my female cresties eats anything that moves.

My concern with the cresties is finding the eggs and ensuring they are safe and making sure that none of the bugs harm the eggs.

 

[latshki]

^
at an expo last year i was talking to a guy about bio active set ups and he had his leos breeding very well in that set up and he even missed a clutch of eggs and they hatched out fine and were bigger babies than the rest and thrived

I love this method although I am selective of what i bring into the house as I will admit to being afraid of most bigs lol
especially cetapieds
i saw a HUGE one in Dom. Rep and nearly died

 

[chechatonga]

Thats a great idea for larger reptiles.....i think my leos would try eating dirt/sand(they definately have before )
___________________________________
check out my site http://reptileisle.webs.com

 

[Johnantny]

You just bring in your local safe sanitation crew- isopods, earthworms too. The wood or sand you bring in will usually supply the flora needed to reach bioactivity. The isopods will hide in groups under the wood or bark. The earthworms will eat the detria and rotting vegetation bits. As for impaction, if the animals are well hydrated and kept optimally, the chance becomes minimal for impaction to occur. Dehydration plays a big role in impaction and has never happened to me or anyone I know who is currently using this tactic.

 

[paulnj]

Impaction is an after effect of the real issue. I know of many 1000's of leos being kept and bred on pure sand currently around this planet with ZERO ill effect. Don't believe everything you read folks, do your own research with an open mind and take NOBODIES opinion as FACT...... especially mine :main_laugh:

 

[Khrysty]

Impaction is an after effect of the real issue. I know of many 1000's of leos being kept and bred on pure sand currently around this planet with ZERO ill effect. Don't believe everything you read folks, do your own research with an open mind and take NOBODIES opinion as FACT...... especially mine :main_laugh:

Lol that hurts my brain to think about, Paul. "Trust no one, not even me!" ..then can I trust your advice not to trust anyone? Maybe I should trust everyone...

:main_rolleyes:

I do think I'll set up a tank with the bio active substrate and see how it goes. I'm not sure I'd like to do it for my tubs, though. How much substrate (John, Gregg, this question is for you) would I need in a tub? Is an inch or two fine?